Young children playing adult games

[gringo]

Recently I have been in discussion with quite a few parents about the games that their children play on consoles or the Pc.

I was wondering what other peoples thoughts are on the subject.

About four months ago I found my eldest sprog playing GTA vice city. He is only 9 years old. He had borrowed the game from a friend in the street, and said that his parents had bought him the game. I immediately uninstalled the game from his PC and told him to bring the game back. A couple of weeks later I caught him again playing the game. Uninstalled the game again, grounded him for a week and read him the house rules.

I spoke to father about the game and he had no idea what the games was really about, but he was quite shocked when I told him. Now after speaking to quite a few parents on the subject, I find out that my son is one of the few children in his age group that DOESN'T play GTA.

None of the parents have got any idea of what the game is all about. Most are quite shocked.
What makes me wonder is, firstly how can you let your children buy games that say on the sleeve 17+ or 18+, sex violence etc and still not have any idea what a game is all about.
Secondly I am wondering do a lot of parents have any idea what their children are doing behind their PC's.

Obviously as children get a little older it gets harder to keep track of everything they are doing, but when you hear of at least 8 of 9 children all aged 9-10 years old playing GTA, or another friend of mine bought his son of 6 years old Halo 2 the first day it came out.
(also mature 17+)


Am I being a worried parent, or am I right in saying that children should be kept clear of playing these games until they are at least a few years older ?

How is this sort of think in other countries? I know in Holland that they are very broad minded, but this seems a bit extreme.

[tasty danish]

i feel that any hard attempt at censorship at a young age will make it that much harder to adjust when they are revealed the adult issues at an older age.
if people TRUELY couldnt tell the difference between a game and reality we would have legions of crazed killers.

as Chris Rock put it:
"whatever happened to just crazy?"

"bad" video games are not making your kids bad people, or making all your hard attempts at raising them for naught.
if you really raised your child correctly, they won't play the game because "omg, his arm got loped off and blood went everywhere then we had sex with 12 people without protection" but rather (and this is a novel concept...) because maybe the game is fun to play.

so what is really the core issue here?
your kid may be looking at intense blood and gore?
well, in the old days we hunted to eat: nuff said.
too much sex and violence? (while the jury may still be out) i feel that a paced introduction to these things will cause less of a fascination with them, as opposed to holding them all back.

kids want so much of what they shouldn't have for that very reason: they shouldn't have it.
that's why they try sneaking peeks in dirty magazines: it's wrong to see naked women.
that's why they cuss: mommy and daddy would whip them if they heard.
that's why they play adult video games: it's against (as you put it) "house rules"

[gringo]

I don't feel that playing bad games will make them bad people, but don't forget you are talking about children aged between 6 and 10 years old.

A big difference compared to a child of 13 - 14 years old.

taking a peek at a girly magazine is all part of growing up, that I can agree with, but do you not think that a child of 9 years old playing Doom 3 just before going to bed is going to sleep peacefully ?

I am the first to admit that I play a lot of games classed as 17+ or 18+ ( COD, far cry, HL2 etc) and as you say they are fun to play, but where do you draw the line with the age group ?

[tasty danish]

if they have trouble sleeping, they got themselves into it, they will learn to stay from it, kinda like placing your hand on a hot stove: they learn and adapt, possibly making them tougher (which in this age of panzies i find very desireable)
of course, if the child simply can not learn that they are not able to handle that experience that spooked them, then it is acceptable to step in for the well being of them and those that live with them (it sucks being woken up by a crybaby).
to this extent it depends on the child really, i've never had nightmares and was watching movies at age 6 that friends of mine could not handle till well into their teens.
i still don't see the big problem with premature exposure.

[gringo]

If you put your hand on a hot plate, it hurts.

But if you play a game or watch a scarey movie, you get scared, but it is the thrill which will bring you back again. You still want to play or watch it again.

Children under the age of 10 have (in my mind) different ideas of how life is , compared to a 14 year old (generally)

How can we know what goes through an 8 year olds mind while playing one of these games. I am not by any means saying that it will end up the child going out at the age of 18, and killing people because that's what happened in the games,because I think that all the stories of game related killings are bull. But it must have some later effect in life.

[germanNiklas]

well im 17
my brother is 5 years older, when i was 11 or 12 he got his pc

my first "brutal" game was unreal tournament, my brother let me play the game, my parents never knew, with 13 i played gta 1, when gta 3 came out i played it too (was 15/16 back then)

i can remember that with 9 i watched my uncle play doom

now im 17, im no psycho, im not agressive, i have violence, i never had a fight and i never want to be in one

i think it depens on how your parents "educte" you

if my parents HAD known what games i had played, they wud have been mad too tho

[gringo]

Ok Niklas, so you played GTA at thirteen years old. But now GTA goes a lot further with regards to aggression, blood and guts etc, and I am talking about 9 year olds, or as I said in my first thread a 6 year old playing Halo 2.


I let my kids do a lot, and they have a lot of freedom but I also feel that some things can wait.

[fancyf]

Gringo I agree.. when I bought the PS2 for the kids (9-11 y old) it came with many games, one was GTA III. When I saw what kind of game it was I told them it didn't make sense, I was with them and commented on stuff that was happening, asking them questions etc. I let them play for a while but they knew I definitely disapproved and knew why.

One thing tho since my kids don't really speak or understand english "yet" that was a PLUS for them. (although my oldest is getting pretty good and could get a few things here and there)

They played a few times, each time we would talk about it and then they never played again. So now when we go and rent one they're the ones checking behind the box to see if they are "allowed to" play it or not.

I didn't quite ban it systematically but what I told them finally got in.

Without saying that those games will or can mess up a kid (and 11y old is still a kid) I still think that you don't make sense as a parent if you feed your kids that violence and !&/$*.... what good could it bring anyway?

[ahurtt]

I am a bit torn on the issue here. . .I am a pretty avid gamer myself and I do in fact love the GTA games. I am also 31 years old and I grew up as video games were coming into being. I am not a dad yet but will be soon. I watched video games evolve from pong to what we have today. I have seen them first hand grow more and more realistic and also more and more violent. And for some reason, the really violent ones seem to be the most fun to play. . .maybe because it's a vent where you can do things to virtual people you'd never really want to do or be able to do in real life, I'm sure we've all heard that argument. But for kids today, they are born into a world where video games have reached a point where graphic violence or sex or anything else for that matter can be reenacted with great life-like detail. Exposure to this kind of stimulus WILL WARP CERTAIN KIDS VIEWS! Not all. But at a younger age, I think it is more likely that prolonged exposure to this kind of thing will warp childrens perceptions of reality and the world around them. These are the most impressionable years of their lives when their perceptions of right and wrong and the world around them are being formed. Most 3d action games today are really advanced enough where it is almost like watching a movie. . .except now you get to be the main character and do the actions you are seeing on the screen. It can be argued therefore that since we have rating systems for movies and the like to prevent them from corrupting young eyes, why should games be any different? Of course the parent is solely responsible for what the kids play and solely responsible for teaching kids right from wrong. Most parents who were never interested in computers or gaming think of video games and think of Super Mario and Pokemon. It never entered their wildest dreams that their 8 year old could be getting a virtual hummer from a hooker in a stolen car in some alley while being hunted for by the police for mowing down pedestrians with an AK-47. I applaud fancyf for the way she handled it. . .so tactful. Actually got the kids to censor themselves! They now know what mom considers wrong or bad and understand that they can't just do something because it's "fun" or they "want to." And for whoever said, "in the old days we had to hunt to eat.. . ." that is a ludicrous comparison and I think you know why. Hunting for survival and carjacking people and mowing down pedestrians for fun. . .well. . .I think you see my point. And we're not in "the old days" any more. Your argument holds about as much water as a sieve. For me, by the time video games reached the point of violence and graphic detail they have today, I was old enough that I knew what was going on. But for kids growing up seeing this stuff for the first time at such levels of detail. . .I fear for them. There is a reason why people say that if you should not do or say anything in front of your young kids that you don't want reenacted or repeated. Kids repeat stuff they see and hear. It is the parent's responsibility to be the dominating influence on their childs development and not hand the responsibility over to the TV or the computer. All that being said, will I let my kids play video games. . .of course! I think that computer and video games can help stimulate certain higher learning functions, cognitive abilities, and critical thinking pathways not to mention eye-hand coordination. But I count myself lucky that I am aware of the potentially damaging nature of some games that exist today and I will monitor very closely what they get exposed to.

[ShadeZeRO]

I say only thing is ...

Try to basically old off on violent games until early teens...cuz all this rap music + gun games is really bad mixture...all that hardcore gangsta for shizzle g dogg and that kinda ****...

I played duke nukem, doom1,2, wolfenstien 3d when i was a kid...i could EASILY tell it was fake, now day's, its more realistic...so that might be a problem compared to before...

Violent games dont make people bad, its what people decide to do after they play them...

games are games, no more, they're here just to entertain us, not to make us mass murderers

[PacNW CE]

I too remember pong and the old atari 2600. Hell, I remember it was a HUGE deal when I got a joystick for our family C64. (Dad didn't view it as a toy, but a machine that I was supposed to program LOGO on)

Games are games, they let you role play into things you wouldn't do IRL. I haven't played any GTA's, and honestly don't have an ounce of desire too. We white suburbian kids used to listen to NWA and Ice T, nowadays it's GTA SA. Basically the same lessons :drugs, guns, murder, prostitiutes, cursing.

The age that Mature themed games become appropriate for you kid is wholey dependant on your kids maturity level. I have to say there is alot of merit to the burning your hand on the stove analogy. I remember watching Polterguist(SP) when I was like 8. To this day, Clowns are spooky to me. Sure, reading Stephen King's IT when I was 13 didn't help any, but it all started with that **** clown. I didn't watch horror movies again until I was older.

To me, gore is neither here nor there. We are 98% water and when you puncture your skin, it's a bit messy. If anything, I'd like my child to understand how fragile our bodies really are, and that people die every day just driving to work. Maybe then they will be a bit more careful in what they do when I am not watching.

Bottom line, the fact that none of the parents knew about the content of GTA is appauling. More parents need to behave like you do and monitor what goes on in their childs virtual world.

[AllGamer]

i can undersand Halo 2 and such

but GTA or anything of that lame reason for a game definitely should be punishable by law

[CrazyCrusher]

I agree I own GTA well temp anyways, Im about to sell both them off on ebay because my kids saw me play it for a few secs, to many questions, and I think by far its not a kids game and any parent that lets there child play something like that needs some checking over them self.

I was told by a buddy of mine when we where in bestbuy two weeks ago he saw two girls in there early teens 14 15 asking the clerk where to find the game he watched him take the girls over remove the game from the shelf and sell it to them. I was nothing more than shocked this guy didnt even as for ID from what I was told, and call me an old **** but if I had seen it I would have said something.

I for one dont blame games on some of the madness that kids do, but more so the parents allowing the child to run a muck and buy the games in the frist place, if they alow that kid to play a game like that then you know that there is something wrong with that house hold in the frist place.

[AllGamer]

i don't mind the GTA and the rest of its series

but definitely not for kids

if any grown up guy plays it, fine by me

but is an extremely bad example for kids or teens

when you play a game stealing ****, and killing prostitues, gang violencen, etc...

[tasty danish]

Originally posted by ahurtt \And for whoever said, "in the old days we had to hunt to eat.. . ." that is a ludicrous comparison and I think you know why. Hunting for survival and carjacking people and mowing down pedestrians for fun. . .well. . .I think you see my point. And we're not in "the old days" any more. Your argument holds about as much water as a sieve.

you have totally taken my point out of context.
save a game or two (manhunt), hunting animals, skinning them, etc. is far more brutal than what is shown in games.
you shoot someone in gta, blood, dead body, wow.
you shoot an animal, carcass, guts, prepping involves more guts, you see my point.
they get used to carnage.
it imposes a very masculine sort of influence that serves to toughen a person.
todays general attitude of "oh i might get dirty if i do x-activity" is pathetic.
you call my arguement weak, yet you have no empirical evidence that makes yours stronger.
you aren't giving your kids enough credit, they know right from wrong easier than you may think.
remember, bugs bunny made racial slurs, references to the holocaust and had tons of violence.
no, i'm not saying you shouldn't watch bugs bunny, but it's not like all the sudden here is all this horrible influence for kids.
sex is all over classic rock and old video games had violence all over the place, it just cartoony so no one cared.

if you have a head on your shoulders, you'll be fine.