Intel or AMD ? What's better ?

[mcalmon]

There many choices now, Athlon, Thunderbird, Duron and P4.

What's the best option???

Thanks,
MCalmon :rolleyes:

[DocEvi1]

depends on what you want.
Durons are slowest.
Athlon and Thunderbird are fast.
P4 is fast (i.e. mghz) but not as fast at working things out as AMD.

The P4 is probably best (someone overclocked a 2gig to around 3.5 I think), they run cooler however are well overpriced.
AMD give fantastic performance (my 1.4Tbird is great) but heat is an issue - you need very good cooling hence the fans (if air cooled) make noise.

You missed another chip out the XP. better than the Thunderbird, and beats the P4 hands-down. Also heat build up isn't as bad I think..


Stefan

[gibsinep]

Defintly go with an Athlon chip. Duron is slower than t-bird which is slower than XP.

Dont go P4 way overpriced and is easily beat but Xp's the person you OC that chip that high had chemical cooling and everything. Thunderbirds 1.2-1.4 are very simple to Over clock because their muliplers are unlocked. Durons can be unlocked ith the pencil trick
and Xp's have to use some thing stronger (laquear)

Intels Chips ALL have LOCKED multipiers. The CAN NEVER be unlocked. They con only be Over clocked through the FSB

Athlons can OC through multipler and FSB

Also T-birds are the hottest. Just get some decent cooling and u will be set. With a bit if case modding. My t-bird 1.33 runs ile 30 C
full 36C

Duron-T-bird-XP are all Athlons

[mcalmon]

Wooao!!!
Thanks gipsinet, you're so clear with your answers...

thanks all,
MCalmon:p

[gibsinep]

No problem glad i could help

[Ammok]

The p4 overclocking to 3.5ghz was done with liquid nitrogen so unless your real good with a chem lab, go XP.

[WyreTheWolf]

Originally posted by Ammok
The p4 overclocking to 3.5ghz was done with liquid nitrogen so unless your real good with a chem lab, go XP.

LOL!

That was a pretty kewl benchmark too... but did you notice how the AthlonXP 2000+ was performing next to the overclocked P4?


BTW AthlonXP CPUs require less wattage than the T-Bird ... and therefore do not require nearly as much cooling.

~Wyre

[JeffD]

Hi mcalmon,

Generally when someone asks a question such as this I'll reply (cpu, video, memory, system, etc.):

1. How much money do you want to spend?

2. What is your targeted use?

I say this since there is such a large price spread and use spread that one item may fit your needs better than another.

Example:

A 1 GHz Duron ($46 Pricewatch) paired with 256MB ram and a decent video card will run virtually any software that an average home computer user will throw at it.

A 1.4 Ghz T-Bird (~$100 Pricewatch) is the best buy for the money but for normal home computer use I'll argue that a person would have a hard time telling the difference between the cpus in the same system (NOT hardcore gaming or for a benchmarking fanatic which would be able to tell the difference).

A Athlon XP2000 ($300+) is for those who care for sheer speed but the budget must be able to withstand the cost.

I agree with other posters that P4's are overpriced and definitely the least bang for your dollar. That's not to say they're bad........

Regards,

JeffD

[bowhunter]

AMD XP

gibsinep, how do you get your t-bird to run that temp? Mine at idle is 53.

[araaraara]

I wouldn't use anything other than an AMD AthlonXP. Pentium4? Over my fried motherboard!

[gibsinep]

Bow hunter i put a 80mm SUNON case fan about 5 inches above my Heatsink/fan mounted a a strip of medal. Cut out a hole for the fan to suck in air and put a grill on it.

[gibsinep]

O Yea i used a dremmal to cut the hole in the Case











GO AMD

[suprsheep2]

I just go with a celeron and overclock it probably more than I should, but who cares it's only worth $40

[gibsinep]

Celeron is ok. But nothing compared to Athlons Duron. Durons are also very overlcockable. Not overly hot. Nut not as cool as cerlys

[Jimstep]

Here's my testimonial:

I've been burned by Cyrix and AMD in the past. Intel always had the better floating point unit in their processors.

I built a system about 2 months ago with the intention of buying an Intel 1Ghz or faster.

I ended up with an AMD Athlon Thunderbird 1.4Ghz 266 processor.

This baby is fast. It runs hotter than Intel, but, so what. It runs and it runs good.

There are a lot of folks that were really happy with AMD. I've heard this pitch before and was skeptical at first. But, I'm a believer now. AMD is making a serious performer with the Athlon line.

I don't like AMD's new marketing scheme with naming their processor's with a model number that equates to something that Intel would sell in Mhz. But, you can't argue numbers. AMD's processors run slower than Intel but perform better. You can't argue with benchmark tests, as long as their not rigged.

Bottom line: For my hard earned dollars, at the time I was ready to buy, Intel was pretty expensive. The money I saved by purchasing the AMD processor paid for my motherboard and memory. I was willing to take that chance and I ended up with a faster setup.

I make a living as a performance tuning guru on mainframe systems. So, AMD appeals to me because I can go in an tweak it to see how far I can push it. It's risky, but fun. I've abused the hell out this system and it just keeps performing.

Good Luck with your search!!

[Kurylo]

Posted by Jimstep: I don't like AMD's new marketing scheme with naming their processor's with a model number that equates to something that Intel would sell in Mhz.
Actually, Athlon XP is marked with a number of MHz the hypothetic AMD Thunderbird should have to gain such speed... Not Intel.

[gibsinep]

I also dont like their new naming system. A bit confusing at times

[mfafa]

AMD AthlonXP ofcourse! And pick a motherboard with the Via KT266A chipset.. that's pretty important to get the most out of the system. Especially when thinking of the DDR RAM.. Gotta unleash it's potential! The out-of-date AMD761 chip don't do that.. So go with KT266A! And today, theres -many- boards with that chipset. You have many to choose from :rolleyes:

[mfafa]

I think AMD's new naming system is only FAIR!! I've heard that Intel on purpose made a very long pipeline on their P4 CPU's just to push up the MHz.. but because of the loong pipeline, work that's get done per MHz sink. Anyways, something like that :p Most users do not understand that number of MHz is NOT the only thing that counts. AMD cpu's really proves that number of MHz isn't everything. Just take a look at some benchmarks. And besides, the new naming system turned out to be a great success :D

[gibsinep]

well i relize that MHZ isnt everything.

[ukulele]

Megaherz Smegaherz. Competition is the name of the game in this market. It is the performance/price ratio that determines the success or failure of a CPU in this cyber sector. Corporate buyers still choose Intel for the most part for exactly this reason. This is not because Intel is faster or more reliable, or cheaper, they are not, it is because for many years all their systems were Intel based and it is usually cheaper to upgrade with the same platform then it is with an new one. This will change someday as everything does and AMD may be the new darling of the corporate world. For now though, the power users have choices and I like AMD. I've been using AMD CPUs since 1995 and a few Intels. I'll take the AMD's any day. They run hot and fast. So What? So does a space shuttle.

[WyreTheWolf]

Quote: "Intel always had the better floating point unit in their processors."

That hasn't been the case since the introduction of the K7. The K7 had a FAR more robust FPU than even the PIII Xeon!

BTW ... did you check out the linux tests between the AthlonXP 2000+ (1.67GHz) and the new "NorthWood" P4 2.2GHz?

The AthlonXP fairly well mopped the floor with the P4.

Not a surprise.

[gibsinep]

AThlon is a better chip

[WyreTheWolf]

Originally posted by gibsinep
AThlon is a better chip

I agree... I build/sell computer systems. We don't even carry any intel product in our store. The reason: AMD Duron (outclasses the celeron... even in price.) AMD Athlon (outclasses pentiums.... even in price.) AMD AthlonXP (ouclasses everything.... even in price.)

Duron System ... is entry level... and start at 399.00 includes 15" monitor
Athlon System ... is mid level ... start at 599.00 includes 17" ,monitor
AthlonXP System ... is high end ... starting at 899.00 includes 19" trinitron (sony), or 21" OptiQuest.. your choice.


If we went with Intel ... our prices would have to jump another 100-300 dollars just to keep up with our overhead.

[BJUK]

Athlon is better value for money. But do run hot so often nead large noisy fans. So if noise is an isue then maybe have to be intel.

[JeffD]

Hi All,

Intel vs. AMD

ATI vs. nvidia

Remember that with any company there are pluses and minuses with a given product whether it be cost, performance, quality, appearance, etc.

The above two examples highlight this fact perfectly and it's truly a rare instance indeed when a company can boast that they have all pluses and NO minuses in the eyes of each consumer!

So what is ideal for one person (in their eyes) may not be ideal for another. This is a BIG reason why there has been countless heated discussions over Intel vs. AMD and nvidia vs. ATI.

Regards,

JeffD

[Tor]

It's kinda funny how when AMD beat Intel to 1Ghz they were strutting their stuff, bragging about speed. Now that Intel is blowing them out of the water, all of a sudden speed doesn't matter anymore. But they still try to fake their customers with numbers, XP1700, 1800 etc.. Trying to make them think that those numbers have something to do with speed. When all they are doing is trying to make people think that they are as fast as P4 1.7 & 1.8Ghz etc. If you want quality & reliability, go with Intel. You might want to check out AMD's DOA and failure rate also. Pretty small compared to quanity, but way more than Intel. Also, your benchmarks that show AMD as better? I could probably get stats to show that a Ford pickup is faster than a Corvette. Not necesarily true though. My 2 pennies worth.

Tor

[8KHA+]

I`m Running the Epox 8KHA+ motherboard with the 1.6 Athlon
what a great setup and great for overclocking.

[bowhunter]

I've been to AMD's web site and they will compare their chip to Intel's and post the results.

I've also been to Intel's web site and have yet to find where they compare their chip to AMD's. Maybe I've just overlooked it. Has anyone else seen it?

AMD all the way!:D

[andyboy110]

i have heard that amd tbirds fry up often.
wat abt the athlon XP.is it better in heat control.

[Jeff253]

The Athlon XP 1700 and Athlon XP 1800 not only compare to the P4 1.7 GHz and P4 1.8 GHz, they surpass them in performance. MHz and GHz doesn't mean a thing when a slower (in MHz) processor could do more operations per clock cycle.

What matters is the end result, if a 1.47 GHz Athlon XP 1700 could execute more operations, especially fp operations then a P4 1.7 GHz, then that's what matters, especially if it's done at a cheaper price.

AMD = low price, better performance;
Intel = rip-off!

AMD = cheap gold.
Intel = expensive silver.

[WyreTheWolf]

In real world tests... the AMD CPUs are the only real choice where cost is an issue!

AMD all the way!

[Ninjaxz750]

Well, from a cost standpoint, i have to agree with most people here that AMD would be the 1st choice.

Personally, I've used AMD 1 time and only once. I had stability issues and actually had to underclock it to have it run with any sort of stability.

I like Intel and have always liked Intel. I run a PIII 1GigHz with RDRAM (on an Intel board btw)and it runs like like an old GM 350 engine block.....Like a rock.

Push comes to shove Intel will always be my 1st choice because of stability. the Slightly higher cost is acceptable to me.

CPU Price examples:
P4 1.6GigHz 512k L2 $158.00
P4 1.6GigHz 256k L2 $140.00
AMD Athlon XP 1600 $105.00
AMD Athlon MP 1.6 $165.00

in the case of the AMD MP, it actually costs more than the Intel (prices by Pricewatch)

I am now building a P4 PC and i'm getting the 1.6 GigHz w the 512k L2 cache, and THAT L2 is what wll make the PC fly!!! larger L2's always seemed to be priced higher than the 256k's simply because the chip can do more!

I also dont have to worry about my CPU frying and catching fire if my fan/heatsink gets displaced/ fails or just loses contact, which i've seen happen. Anyone who wants to see AMD chips catch fire can go to Toms Hardware and check it out....That just plain scared me!!!!:eek:

[Ammok]

My PIII 1ghz fried itself, I would normally take the blame and initially thought I had put the fan on upside down, but i am begining to think the heatsink could not have been sitting properly perhaps. Anyway, bloody **** and it had 512kb cache.
More stable more robust my bottom.

To replace the bugger it was cheaper getting a 1.4 athlon which is rock solid and lets me batter it incessantly with different voltages FSB and other various abuses to my hearts content.

I thought Intel were supposed to be able to take the heat? even if the bloody heatsink was on wrong?. BTW it was an auction purchase and i know i should have checked, more fool me.

[gibsinep]

Yeah I thought intels chips had a thing that stopped thjem from burning themselves alive.

[WyreTheWolf]

Originally posted by gibsinep
Yeah I thought intels chips had a thing that stopped thjem from burning themselves alive.

It doesn't always work. I have a fried 750MHz PIII at work ... because the fan failed.

Replaced the heatsink ... and to no avail. It was toast.

[andyboy110]

guys will athlonXP will be cool with just one cpu cooler even if i run memory intensive operations?

[Tron]

Yes andyboy110 You can run a amd XP with one fan but i guess it has to run at 3000rpm minimum.

The ahtlon xp and all palomino cpu´s are staying much cooler than the thunderbirds!!!


Greets
tron:)

[Strawbs]

what's all this talk of AMD's running hot, if you don't OverClock then you won't have to unzip the case or put a boeing turbo prop in there and you'll have less problems with PSU's as well.
:cool:

[slacker85]

Get any AMD. If you want power, get an AthlonXP.
'nuff said.

[Ammok]

Whatsamatter with a Boeing Turbo prop, they need the business anyway!

[gibsinep]

Seroiusly thought Heat is not much of a big deal if u dont OC.
And all u ppl out their comlaining how hot a t-bird runs well

mine
t-bird 1.33
stock heatsink
1 80mm case fan blowing on it




idle 33 C Full 35C

and that is OC at 1400

[Ninjaxz750]

I have installed many Intel CPU's over my time here on earth and i have had my share of CPU heatsink improper installs/ Fans breaking (housings or wiring, not actual fan) and I've NEVER had an Intel fry on me. My worst case has been that it locks up..period.

[BlackThorn]

Just a few facts...
Duron is slower than t-bird which is slower than XP. Actually, this isn't necessarily true. The Durons 1.0GHz and faster are built on the same core as the XP, so these durons have the same computing power per megahertz as the original Athon's do. I know this for a fact - I've got a 1.0GHz Duron, and when I OC it to 1.173 its benchmarks in Sandra 2001 are practically identical to those of my friend's Athon 1.2GHz.

Performance wise, with the P4 series of chips you'll pay roughly twice as much for the performance, as what you'd pay for an AMD that gives the same performance.

The XP chip does run a bit cooler, but not significantly. The P4 has only 2 siginificant advantages: 1. It's easier to install without physically damaging the chip. 2. In the rare case that your HSF unit were to fail or fall of during use, the P4 can handle this and keep going, but the AMD counterpart will instantly go up in smoke.

All around, the XP is the best chip, at least at the moment.

[dukeswan]

i like intel
fan goes on a intel chip it shuts off
fan goes on a athlon....new keychain
so yes athlon is the best
but i still like intel
check out this link
i built this system way cheaper than the athlons that are beating me

http://www.sysopt.com/cgi-bin/database.cgi?go=1&db=bench&allcpu=All+Processors&manufac=All&sort=Benchmark+Score&rperpage=50&bench=SiSoft+Sandra&k=

[WyreTheWolf]

How much total? I have a whole whopping $600 in mine.

[dukeswan]

260 for the processors
65 for the motherboard
yeah i bought a antec 830 case 85
total
yeah a whopping 410 all the other components came from another system