Fluid coming from my motherboard !

[twabzie]

Due to last resorts.. I tried smelling the board for any smell of burn. But instead I found two transistors with fluids coming out from them. The motherboard is a Abit KA7. The transistors which have fluids leaking from it is situated near the CMOS jumper settings and one near the RAM slots.
The board seems to be running alright but it can't detect any harddrives.

Anyone think that this motherboard is still usable ? How about a RAID card install to detect the hardrives instead of the ones IDE controller in the motherboard ? Do you think this will work ?

How about if I sent the motherboard to have the transistors replaced ? Is that possible ? Will the board still be usable ?

Any comments ? Please do state any comments ! Please.. I am really desperate .. I can't find anymore motherboards for Slot A Athlons anymore.

[mraltoid19]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! Don't get the motherboard fixed!!!!!!! If your motherboard is indeed fried (I can't tell but whenever I hear of things oozzing out of somthing that cant be good) A raid/ata100 card is a good Idea to but if you don't have one they run for about 50 bucks. If I were you I'd buy a new motherboad. Now I know the KA7 is a slot mobo but you can pick up an SiS 735 based mobo from ECS for $65!! And probably pick up an Athlon 1.0 Ghz (or Duron if you want the new core) for about $60. Visit www.pricewatch.com for prices also check out www.ubid.com for some deals.


Keep it real.

[piyopiyo13]

Fluid coming from a motherboard is definitely not a good thing. If your motherboard is old, you might as well buy a new motherboard that supports RAID and that works. Last time I checked, RAID controllers at CompUSA cost $99, while built-in on a motherboard they cost an extra $20 or so. If you just got your motherboard and it's still within the warranty and you can live without your system for a few days, it might be preferrable to just send it in for a repair.

[V_I_R_U_S]

I have heard of a few other people who had this problem with the Abit KA7. I would stay away from buying that board.

[DanU]

Looks like I'm going to have to revise my Grand Theory of Electronics to include fluid loss. My old theory states that electronics run on smoke. This smoke is manufactured into the product. When the smoke escapes, the product ceases to function.

Standard PCI IDE adapters reasonably priced. IDE adapters with RAID will cost extra. If you don't need RAID, just get a regular PCI IDE adapter. Promise is a popular brand, but there are others.

[twabzie]

Thanks for the suggestions ! :) Actually not only two transistors have fluid oozing from them... lots of them had. Anyone knows what might have caused this to happen ? Was it too much voltage going into the board or is my power supply insufficient ? I am using a 250W power supply for my 700mhz athlon.
Will an auto voltage regulator help ?

[RavantH]

I'm not good with mobos, but I'm taking a high school tech course... and fluid coming from transistors means one thing...(so far that I learned, anyway...) the voltage is way too high. I sort of was making a transistor radio that was supposed to run on 1.5 volts, and I wanted to see if I could pick up more with a 9v battery... the transistors leaked. One question, I know this sounds stupid, but does the computer have any surge protectors hooked up, and if so, what kind?

[BFlurie]

Are you sure it's actually fluid, and not hardened resin?

[twabzie]

too much voltage ? that maybe the problem. I have asked one of the local computer vendors at my place and he said that it might have been the moist that caused it.
And yes the computer is on a lightning arrestor/isolator. It's by cal-labs and it's made in malaysia.. don't think you have heard of it before.


Dried resin ? I am not sure what that might be, but if it's the black stuff on top of the transistors.. yes some of them had it. There was a time I looked at the mobo and yes there were still fluid, not yet hardened. It's like the fluid that comes from batteries. Brown and oily ? :) Some transistors were also bloated. The usual flat top has a bump on it. There were also dried stuff at the bottom of the legs of the transistors. Not sure what that might be.

[rjwilke]

I acnt believe that your mobo still works at all! You toasted it somehow. Maybe you should cjeck your power supply output voltages before you install a new mobo. By the way, 250watts is sometimes OK for Athlons but 300watts certified by AMD for Athlons is better. Sounds like you need a new PS anyway. Good luck;)

[twabzie]

Yes.. it actually is still working without the transistors. I even got it to boot once until the Loading Windows Millenium.. It just stalled after that..
I should get a 300w PS. Can't afford to fry another mobo :)
thanks for the advice

[DanU]

Originally posted by BFlurie
Are you sure it's actually fluid, and not hardened resin?

I was going to ask the same thing. Transistors are solid state devices, meaning no fluid (except for the magic smoke).

twabize, are you sure it's the transistors that are leaking? The transistors are the black square plastic components on the motherboard. They're about 1cm square. Some mobos have them lying down on the circuit board. Others have them "standing up", sometimes mounted on a little heatsink of their own.

If anything is leaking, it's gotta be the electrolytic capacitors. They're cylindrical and look like little batteries standing up on the mobo. If you exceed their voltage rating or reverse the polarity, pressure build up and that can force the liquid electrolyte out of the capacitor. In extreme cases they'll expand (look bloated) and may even explode.

[PCGuy760]

Originally posted by RavantH
I'm not good with mobos, but I'm taking a high school tech course... and fluid coming from transistors means one thing...(so far that I learned, anyway...) the voltage is way too high. I sort of was making a transistor radio that was supposed to run on 1.5 volts, and I wanted to see if I could pick up more with a 9v battery... the transistors leaked. One question, I know this sounds stupid, but does the computer have any surge protectors hooked up, and if so, what kind?

Remember that Transistors dont burn out for no reason 99% of the time. It is possibly some other fault on the Mobo that caused the Transistors to burn out, possibly a short circuit in some other components that caused a current/voltage surge.

In my opinion I think its best u replace the whole board, it being of intricate circuitry, I would not advise u to fix it, cos if it happens to have a MAJOR short circuit at a later date, it could mess up your other hardware etc. Dont risk it dude!

;)

[twabzie]

thanks DanU for correcting me. It's indeed the capicitors that leaked. Did not know what those things are called.. Thanks :)
I am already getting a new board but I need to know how I can prevent this from happening again in the future. If there too much voltage going through the board. Should I get a new power supply unit ? I am currently using a 250w unit. How about an Auto Voltage Regulater ? The electricity supplied to my place is not always at a same rate.. Sometimes it could get really low. I can see my ceiling lights dim out. Then sometimes too high.

[RavantH]

Pardon about the "no reason" crack, it's a habitual thing for me to say... sometimes I say it for no reason... (sorry.) But seriously... did I say transistor? Oh man, my tech teacher would shoot me... I meant capacitor. There was a reason for it leaking... I stuck a 9v battery to a 1.5v capacitor... alone at first... oops. ;) Anyway... yeah, sorry about the mixup between transistor and capacitor. On the radio, I had both so I got confused while looking at the setup while I was typing in the post. Like I told my tech teacher, I'm a C++ programmer, not a hardware expert. One more thing... no, I've never heard of that surge supressor that you have... chances are, it didn't help much.

[edalha]

Hi RavantH
If, as you say, your household power varies quite a bit (evidenced by dimming lights) you'll need a power line conditioner. This is an industrial type answer for "mission critical" computers where AC power might not be very stable. Although a spike protected power strip for surge protection will help with high voltage spikes, it cannot make up for low voltage (which is just as harmful to your mobo and power supply as high voltage spikes). Usually a good power line conditioner will smooth out voltage in a range from 90VAC to 130VAC (or if your on 220VAC some similar range of fluctuation). Sorry to hear about your present mobo problem. This is not a simple solution but one that should safeguard your future computing.

Edalha

[edalha]

Hi twabzie,
I mistakenly posted my answer to RavantH though the thread began with you. I hope this suggestion will help although this tends to be a costly proposition as power line conditioners tend to be expensive.


Edalha

[wobly]

I agree with the last post. I use an APC Back-UPS Pro and it has saved my ***. I was pretty mad when the previous one went up in smoke, but it saved my computer. $70 for the Back-UPS or $1500+time+effort+complaining-from-the-wife-while-I-rebuild made it a good investment. BTW, I am in Germany on a military installation and the power flucuates quite a bit with our old wiring. Not as bad as someplace like...oohh...California, but bad enough to warrant an Uninterruptible Power Supply.

[in2golf]

It is probably resign. One of the only things that have fluid in them are Capacitors. The board is probably junk do to the fact that it will cost more to fix than a new one.

[in2golf]

one other thing. If it still works then you probably blew caps not transistors. Transisotrs are flat on at least one side. Caps are usually round and sometimes light blue or black with a negetive symbol on it.

[in2golf]

sorry about the above two comments I did not read down far enough. I would also get a new power supply. It may be damaged.

[shigum]

I recently saw the same thing on three different Abit KA7 boards. They seem to have made a bad batch or something. Two of the boards were dead, but the third is still running, even though you can see a black substance on top of several of the capacitors by the cpu slot. I guess it's only a matter of time til it dies too. And the kicker is that the boards are all at three different businesses that I know of, so I don't think power is the issue.

[edalha]

Well,
the power situation is not quite so dire here now... It just cost an arm and a leg, (a gold-capped tooth, your first born child and a refinance on your home mortgage)!!!!


edalha

[Explorer]

The problem probably wasn't caused by your power supply although it's a slight possibility. More likely, the voltage regulator on the motherboard packed it in. A lot (most newer ones anyway) use 3.3 volts for most of the busses, etc, provided by the voltage regulator stepping-down the 5V lines from the power supply. A jump to 5V from 3.3 represents about an 80% increase with a consequent major increase in current flow, heat etc. Really hard on capacitors.

Not to mention everything else on the board. I'm surprised your CPU survived but it's probably supplied by another regulator.

APC (American Power Conversion) http://www.apc.com/my/products/ manufacturers a wide range of back-up uninterruptable power supplies. Very good surge protection and the battery provides some protection against low voltage swings. But probably quite expensive in Malaysia.

[DualShock]

Hey everyone, here's the lowdown on the KA7 problem:

This is a quite common problem with this board. My board experienced the same thing: capacitors next to the CPU slot are leaking black stuff (the dielectric).

Twabzie, you are not alone. This has been posted many, many times in the ABIT newsgroup alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit.

[LostBok]

Funny! I as reading the whole thing and picturing Capacitors while reading transistors...

Chances are if it is a well known manufacturing problem, then they will replace it free of charge, whatever the age...

Once you've got a woking system, I suggest you seriously conside a surge supressor board and a UPS system after that. Surge supressors go for $10-$30 and UPS systems are anythign from $50-$500.... Try a "Liebert Powersure Proactive 700Va" for about $150 or a "Liebert Powersure Personal 300Va" for about $60... that way you fry a cheap board on most power spikes and not the UPS, then the UPS will smooth out the more extreme power fluctuations and protect the system.... plus get a decent 300W dual fan PSU to make sure....

Of course you'll probably be fine once you've replaced that mobo...

[DualShock]

It's not a matter of the power entering the computer, it's a matter of CHEAP CAPACITORS. According to some users in the newsgroups, it seems ABIT used a lower quality capacitor for this board.

ABIT will repair/replace the board for free if you still have your original sales invoice. If you don't, it will cost $25. Send an e-mail to technical@abit-usa.com (if you're in the USA).

Some newsgroup users have said they replaced the capacitors themselves. Search the newsgroup alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit to see how they did it, if you want to go that route.

[twabzie]

Thanks guys for your suggestions and advice.

Not many people in my place uses UPS. It's not common here as the prices are quite high. I will be replacing the power supply to a 300W soon and they cost about RM100 which is about USD26. Is this the pricing that you guys get in the US ?

I have an old UPS lying around. It's by PhoenixTec. Anyone heard of it before ? I don't think it's working. I have already replaced the board with another Abit board . A kt7a. Still sticking to Abit even after the first board :) The old board is beyond repair and the capacitors cannot be replaced without some machinery. The solderings too fine to be done by hand. That's according to what my local vendors say.

Thanks again to everyone who gave suggestions and advice and for reading
:)

[RavantH]

Isn't Phoenix the people that make the bios?

[jdogstarman]

Electrolytic Caps (short for capacitors) are very easy to repace yourself. The values are listed clearly on the component (assuming they aren't browned or blown up). If you are steady of hand you can do it yourself with a $10.00 soldering iron and about $5.00 worth of parts.

Capacitors act like little batteries, i.e. current storage devices. They serve to smooth and filter the voltage levels on the mobo expecially around other chips and on the voltage input . When continually heated up and cooled the rubber gasget on the lead end gets hard and electrolyte leaks (this is why electronics last longer if left on all of the time--caps don't like varied duty cycles). You will notice they are scored in an "X, Y or K" pattern on the top. This is to make them blow "up" out of the top instead of out--they make quite a mess. You can replace them with higher voltage components as well.

You might want to get a new mobo and experiment with this one--definately not worth having someone else work on!!!

[coder53]

Hey twabzie,

I can't say enough how much a good uninterruptable power supply can protect your system. It sounds as if those times when your lights go dim (called "brown-outs") may be the culprit that distroyed your motherboard. Immediately following the "brown-outs" there is a voltage spike. Spike and surge protectors use electronic devices that eventually fill-up (in a way) and no longer provide you with any protection.

Good luck with correcting the problem. It is good to see you can still get on-line.

[PimpG420]

I just had in mind to maybe buy a AMD 1800 & Abit KT7A combo under $300, from this post maybe not. Hmmm

[twabzie]

hey why not ? it's a good deal. I was unfortunate to get that board. I replaced it with an abit kt7a with athlon 1.13ghz. Been running fine since then :)

[Bsamuels]

Ya I agree that it was most likely a power surge, Just wondering, do you ever turn your surg protector off, because those are designed to work only when they are turned off I believe, so if it was left on at all times, than a power surge is prolly your answer.

[PimpG420]

power surge killed my new 450 when i just put in the parts, left to make coffee in the microwave hit start and Boom that was end of that system, lucky i got some parts back.

[AzKidd69]

If you keep having power spikes and brown-outs.. You might want to look into getting an Un-interruptible Power Supply (UPS) with line conditioning... That way the voltage stays at 120v even if the power fails completely ( at least for a few mintues.).