More Napster stuff...Anyone see Lars and Chuck D on Charlie Rose?

[daveleau]

They went at it pretty good. I didnt see the beginning but caught most of it. I have been a fan of metallica for many many years and have all of their cds or tapes. I think a bonfire is in order though. I just got banned from Napster because of them.
Dave

I heard some guy was even being brought up on charges that found a way around the ban.

[This message has been edited by daveleau (edited 05-13-2000).]

[ceedee]

you got banned why ??

[Wiz]

dave was probably sharing some metallica songs. I have a bunch of metallica songs i'm sharing, but they are all unreleased stuff. demos and such.

[chipbgt]

No Dave, you got banned because you were giving people access to a copyrighted piece of material that they did not own, and metallica was Just exercising there rights of ownership.

That's why you got banned.

Ohhhh.....now it makes more sense..... http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif

[This message has been edited by chipbgt (edited 05-13-2000).]

[mgordon99]

chipbgt said:

you were giving people access to a copyrighted piece of material that they did not own

come on, how did you know that they did not own it?

Unless Metallica has undisputible proof that all of the MP3's were pirated (which they don't), this is not a valid argument, just because it's "possible" to download pirated music on Napster. (sorry, usernames just aren't enough)

Why isn't Metallica going after the makers of all ftp programs? We all know how easy it is to download MP3's via ftp. Why? Because it's the users who are the alleged perpetrators, not the programs, this is no different with Napster.

[Biff]

Excellant point mgordon, I never even thought of that!

[chipbgt]

Well then If you own the cd's, then I am sorry. That you can control. But with a program like napster (at least to my knowledge, never used) you cant really control who can download from you if you have the file in the shared part of your hard drive; You are rightmgordon99, who knows if they own a copy of there own. There is no way to know, so of course there is going to be suspiciion that they dont. And my understanding is that when you agree to use napster you agree to allow other people to download whatever you make available. Do you get what I was trying to get at? It is one thing to have mp3's that you made or bought from a license distributor, its another for someone to get your legal mp3's and use them for there own pleasure. I meant nothing towards you.

Now I know every copy of a metallica mp3 is not illegal. But there is still wrongdoing going on, and Metallica (no matter how much they SUCK) felt this is what was neccesary to slow down the flow of illegal music.

I have plenty of mp3's. But they are all from cd's I own and made myself, so I know they are legal. Call me a dweeb but I am not going to be part of something thatis so ambigous in its legalities.

Dave, just a question, I honestly don't know the answer; is it "legal" to download a song you dont own , listen to it and then delete it if you dont plan on buying it?

[mgordon99]

chipbgt,

I agree that there is pirated music on Napster, no question. The question is, of the millions of songs and users, how does one dissect what is pirated and what is not? I think this is quite the impossible feat, so in turn we throw the baby out with the bath water, so to speak.

Who is to say what particular songs, whether on the giving end or the receiving end, are pirated? There is just no way to know, so Metallica is assuming guilt by association when it comes to their songs. And the same thing is true with the recording industry, when they hear the term MP3; they immediately associate piracy with it.

[chipbgt]

But is that the best solution, to just throw your arms up and say "oh well! We cant decide which are legal and which arent, so we will just A) let them all be downloaded willy-nilly (Napsters view) or B) shut em all down (Metallica's view). Neither view is a very logical one, just lazy ones. I may not know the solution, but I am sure there is a better way to handle this, on both sides of the coin.

Besides, I like babies; Im not going to throw any out a window. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif

[daveleau]

I truly don't know Chipbgt. I doubt that it is legal but it is at least partially ethical if it is illegal. Kind of like listening stations at music stores. Same concept except at home. I doubt it is legal b/c int he real world, few are going to do this.
Dave

[Mntsnow]

He is being charged with "criminal facilitation" http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

Mntsnow

[daveleau]

I decided not to share my files, I just DL files after all of the hub-ub.

Chipbgt-
I will forgive you this time http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif, but your assumptions about me are dead wrong . I do not DL copyrighted material that I do not own or plan to buy. I may DL stuff to see if I like it B4 buying. I own the cd for every MP3 I own. That makes it legal.

I did DL some Metallica between the 28th and 30th and that is why I am banned. I own those cd's but will not own them or the MP3's for long. Anyone want my collection? I am through with Metallica.
Dave


[This message has been edited by daveleau (edited 05-13-2000).]

[neo_otyugh]

how do they go about banning you?

[davey]

okay...im coming in on this thread a bit late but....has anyone heard of radio!!?? it's a great invention, iv'e been ripping tunes off it for years...so arrest me!!
nothing personel guys but this is just running on y'know

[ghostface]

the radio analogy is good. the fear that the music industry isn't that a bunch of college kids are gettin' mp3s off their high speed access but it's the fact that all these new digital formats makes large volume pirating easy. so instead of getting that crappy bootleg tape of songs on the street, now you get a nice bootleg cd with perfect quality. which of course cuts into the profit margin of the corporate mothership and that's just a no no.

[davey]

I can see what u mean ghost about the high volume perfect quality thing but iv'e always found taping from cd's pretty good quality anyway, but maybe cause my music system is a bit low qual.but to get back to the napster thing, all the stuff ive had from it has been pretty low quality mp3's, some of them hiss some of them glitch I mean ,i wouldn't stop buying albums and make something like napster my only source of music another thing i like about albums is the artwork and feeling of connection with that artist when i buy the album

[This message has been edited by davey (edited 05-24-2000).]

[daveleau]

I had my setup to not share songs. Once I DLed the new songs, they were shared until I restarted the program. Once I restarted and it asked me if I wanted to share (I say no) then it sets my sharing library to zero again until I DL more stuff. That is truly why I got banned. For an hour I WAS sharing songs. I am not upset that Metallica did this, I am just really put off by their closed-mindedness. They do not seem to listen to others' arguements. If they look throughout history (which does in fact repeat itself), every new advance has been seen as a threat to the normal routine. Typically it is an over-reaction. I believe this will be an overreaction as well.

I originally began not sharing songs b/c the system would lock up when I got 20 people DLing songs from me. It was a bit too much. the napster software would just freeze (the rest of my system would be fine). Now I do it to keep the Metallicas and Dr. Dres from doing the same thing all over again. I do not want to distribute and get busted until the dust has cleared. In all fairness though, I do not DL much of these at all anymore b/c I don't want to be bothered by the legality of it all. I will not become a Napsterite again until some of the issues are resolved. I just wish it would happen soon. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif
Dave

BTW rh17- I am sure I will come back around and begin to like Metallica (the older better stuff) again after this is over. i just resent the way they are handling things. I think they could do it alot better and still get their point across without looking like jerks and saying that they could care less about their fans that use napster.

[This message has been edited by daveleau (edited 05-24-2000).]

[rh71]

Daveleau said: I did DL some Metallica between the 28th and 30th and that is why I am banned.

False. No matter where you look for reasoning of the ban, it will specify that you were banned from Napster because you shared the songs, not downloaded them. They cannot tell that you downloaded, only shared. The case may have been that you completed the download to a directory which is being shared across Napster... thus, you're sharing the download.

Hey, I got banned because I shared everything I had of Metallica. I am just as big a fan as you were before. This doesn't make me hate them. Are you kidding me? In my opinion, their music (moreso the older stuff) is still the best out there. I'm not going to avoid listening to their music because they banned me from Napster. They had every right to do so... DISTRIBUTING (knowingly or not) IS ILLEGAL and Napster is the perfect MP3 haven to catch people at doing it. I got busted, but I'm not going to stop listening to their music because they banned me from an internet service. That's absurd.