So, you want to help, huh?

[grandslammer]

Here's one for all of you. Recently my sister in Ohio went to help my other
sister in Maryland. Both she and her husband were (are) in pretty bad
shape, and they both recently came back from extended stays in the hospital.

So, there was Carol (Ohio) at Aileen's (Maryland). Eddie (husband in
Maryland) had a fibrillator implanted in case his heart stopped, it would
"shock" it into rhythm. Anyway........

Carol and Aileen are sitting in the living room, and they hear a whoom! So
Carol goes running into the study to see Eddie lying (half-sitting) on the
floor. (this is where it gets interesting!) Seemingly the fibrillator went
off and knocked the sh*t out of him on it's own (by mistake?) Okay, the
thing's got a short and they went to the hospital and got it replaced.

Now, remember? Carol was helping him up to his chair? Well, after she
grabbed him, the damned thing went off again, sending her out of the room
and up against the wall in the hall! No sh*t! She told me that it hit her
so hard it messed her up for well over an hour and she felt it longer than
that!

Now at this point, she kinda wanted to help him, but instead of picking him
up, she pushed the chair next to him and then an ottoman so he could kind of
"climb" back to the chair where he waited for the paramedics.

Just a not here, Carol didn't say if the paramedics got shocked or not.
Guess I'll have to ask about that.

Now, could you imagine? Driving around the beltway in rush hour traffic and
BOOM! "Clear!"

Anyway, just thought I'd share that with y'all!



[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 05-14-2000).]

[desmocat]

Thats weird.. Do they have any kind of precaution on how to handle them if it goes off for real? On the other hand,you need to take him fishing..ZZZZZAAAPPP! Instant limit-out, no bait, no poles,just string 'em up!
And the game warden hasn't a clue http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif J/K
Seriously, I hope they are both doing better now. Mark

[grandslammer]

Yeah, thanks they're both doing okay for now....... But can you imagine? I told them that if it wasn't the army (he retired from the army, so it was done ay Walter Reed) he should've sued them. I mean really - "yeah, I'll take a whopper, fries and a AARRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHH! ZAP!

'ya know?

M

[Wiz]

i smell a lawsuit. They should have tested the thing ebfore installing it next to someone's HEART!

[grandslammer]

Yeah, that's what I thought!

http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

M

[madthumbs]

keep your car away from most garages, and it will live longer. keep your body away from most doctors, and you will live longer.

[wyvrn]

Hmm not sure about the wisdom of that last post...

You would think with how much he probably paid for that device that it would be in PERFECT working order, after all we are talking about someone's life.

[michelletje]

Wow that's what they call electro shock therapy;-)
They are so far with technics why could they
make it more stable.
It measure hart beat and if there isn't any it gives a shock to the hart muscle.
How could it happen that it puts the hole body under electric power ain't that thing connected to the hart?
Are there more people who had the same problem?

Michelletje

[Prospero]

I just about got shocked in a code once at work. The nurse jumped the gun a bit when she hit the buttons, and a few of us had to scramble quick. There wouldn't happen to be any stray rf noise around that study would there?

[ceedee]

i dont really care either way

[Chainsaw]

Hope he's alright now, what a bummer of a day huh, I guess I should be glad the govt. reneged on their promise to give me medical benifits.
c:::CHNsaw

[krusty the klown]

Hi grandslammer,

I hope your relatives are a lot better, after what must have been an extremely scary experience for all.

Modern implantable defibs are quite complex - they analyze the electrical signal generated from the heart (the ECG), do some fancy signal processing and decide whether the heart is beating normally. They can serve two purposes: to 'pace' the heart, if the rhythm is irregular and to defibrilate the heart if VF is detected (venrticular fibrilation, where the heart quivers randomly and no blood can be pumped - like after a heart attack). This of course means that the device can 'go off' if it thinks the heart is in VF. Now, why the machine decided to shock could be down to a couple of things - a genuine malfunction of the device, EM interference (although the device should be able to accept EM interference: you don't exactly want to be defibrilated every time someone uses a mobile fone!) or the device genuinely detected VF. However, if that was the case, your sister's hubby would have had some symptoms before the device 'went off'. It is possible that he could have had a very mild heart attack that was not life-threatening, but caused sufficient irregularity in the heartbeat to 'trip' the device, or if he suffers from severe chronic angina, an attack may have mimicked the symptoms of a mild heart attack.

A heart attack (myocardial infarction) is caused by a small blood clot occluding an artery that supplies blood to a region of heart muscle. The muscle, starved of oxygen, stops rhythmically contracting and can put the rest of the heart muscle 'out of step' (imagine what happens to a parade of marching soldiers if one of them falls over - chaos!). With angina, the arteries supplying the heart muscle are narrowed. Certain factors can lead to the artery going into spasm, severley restricting blood flow to that piece of muscle, which is similar to a heart attack.

OK, the background out of the way, there are a few implications: firstly, if your sister's hubby had a history of angina, the effects of his pre-existing condition should have been considered when deciding his treatment. Secondly, if he had a very mild heart attack, this would have been detectable from blood samples and an ECG, which should have been performed at the hospital. Thirdly, was he part of a clinical trial for a new type of implantable defibrilator??

Your relatives may wish to put the whole event behind them as best they can and try to get on with their lives (not everyone wants to sue eachother http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif ). But if they do wish to take the matter further, this may make some food for thought.

Whatever happens, I hope he makes a speedy recovery.

For some background reading:
http://www.n-link.com/~ehilton/aicd.htm

and:
http://www.cardio.com/articles/defibril.htm

Some details on FDA recommendations:
http://www.fr.com/publis/f_broch3.html

In recent years, the FDA has received numerous complaints of medical device failures and malfunctions caused by electromagnetic interference. In particular, apnea monitors, wheelchairs, and implantable devices such as pacemakers and defibrilators have been susceptible to the emissions of nearby radio transmitters such as cellular phones, walkie talkies and pagers. As a result, the FDA has begun to request electromagnetic compatibility testing and data submissions in connection with certain device approvals. Based primarily on international standard IEC 801, these tests often involve expensive and complicated emissions and immunity testing with which most manufacturers are currently unfamiliar. The FDA is in the process of determining whether to expand its electromagnetic compatibility testing requirements to broad categories of medical devices similar to programs now going into effect in Europe.

BTW: I'm not a doctor, or an expert in implantable defibs, just learnt about them on my Masters degree!

[grandslammer]

Thanks for the info, Krusty. Nice job by the way. Nah, I doubt seriously they would take things any further, at this point I figure they're both happy to still be breathing!

Neither would ever have voluntarily been a part of any research, although I wouldn't put it past the government to do it anyway.

Now from what I gather (from a distance........) the unit was determined "faulty" and replaced. (In my opinion, an admission of error or at least the fact that they had used a faulty piece of equipment.)

Now I admit, any time you make a few thousand (or more) of something, you're going to have a few bad ones, but with something this important - well, you'd think there might be more "strenuous" testing, you know?

Anyway, for now all is well. Thanks for your opinions and concern.

http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif

M