440BX Socket7

[c3p0-11n]

Is there a socket 7 MB that uses the 440bx chip set?

Thanks for any replies
Bruce

[vagpap]

Correct me if I'm wrong but this particular chipset is designed for Slot 1 processors (PII) and I don't believe that it supports socket7 processors (Pentium MMX,K6-2 etc).
I haven't yet come up with a super7 mobo that uses this chip. They use MVP3 or Aladdin V chisets.

[Peter M]

vagpap is right ... Intel 440BX chipset (the 443BX north bridge part, to be exact) is a P6 bus north bridge, meaning that you can use Pentium Pro, Pentium-II and -III as well as Celerons and Xeons with it.

Socket 7 CPU interface is very different - if you're shopping for a new mainboard you either want a performance combination with VIA's MVP3+596B or MVP3+686A/B north/south combination, or a value all-in-one workhorse, in which case you're looking for an SiS 540 board, or one built with the older VIA MVP4+686A/B or SiS 530+5595.

Regards, Peter

[c3p0-11n]

Thanks vagpap, and Pete that would explain why I can not find one. I have a mvp3 and Aladdin board and have heard so much good things about the stability of the 440. I guess it is time to move up in the processor ranks, now which way to go since the pen boards won't run the amd chips and vice versa.
Thanks again for your replies and the lesson

Bruce

[Jmc_uk]

Its the 430PCi Chipset that Intel have for Socket 7 M/Boards

I think.....dont hold me to that thou!

[c3p0-11n]

jmc-uk is it as stable as the 440 bx?

[Peter M]

You're asking the wrong question, c3p0.

Any given production chipset isn't stable or unstable in itself - it's all up to mainboard design quality and BIOS maturity.

The longer a chipset is around, and the more iterations of board designs have been done with it, the better will the latest of boards using it be.

It's always the same game - with early boards and early BIOS revisions, you probably won't see the full performance potential, and you'll encounter the occasional compatibility quirk here and there. When the platform matures, everything gets ironed out over time, and things become faster and less troublesome.

If you take the AMD route, you'll be pretty safe with VIA's KT133 chipset - the north bridge part is already the second generation Athlon part after KX133, and the 686 south bridge has already come a long way ever since it has been introduced to pair with the MVP4 socket-7 north.

Same goes for P-III solutions with VIA Apollo 133A. BIOS engineers have learned how to squeeze appropriate memory performance out of the chip. The platform matured from the original Apollo Pro over the rare Apollo BX, then Apollo+, Apollo 133 to today's 133A - without any really major changes, so the learning curve definitely is done with. The 686 south bridge is the same part as for Athlons.

Regards, Peter

[otheos]

the 430 chipset (FX/TX/HX/VX) is outdated. it was very good 5 years ago but today it is outclassed by any other chipset due to the low FSB (66 only) and limited SDRAM (VX/TX only) support. If you are looking for a SS7 board, intel is NOT what you should look for as they abandoned it over 3 years ago. Look for VIA or ALi or SIS, depending on your budget and use. At the moment, the King of SS7 motherboards is the EPoX MPV3G2/5 (ATX but there is also an AT format). Other boards are good too, DFI, Asus (old though), Tyan (we talk about their SS7 boards!). If you want K6-2/3+ support the Epox is your choice (bios+voltage support) with the Asus (only voltage, but works ok with latest bios-not optimised).

Good luck.

[Peter M]

otheos, please update your recommendations http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

The DFI K6BV3+/66-2 and K6XV3+/66-2 boards officially have "+" model support, and also bring UDMA66 and 2 MB L2 cache - making the BV board the only BAT form factor SS7 board with those features.

Regards, Peter

[otheos]

ok, but so does the Epox G5. official + support 2MB cache and UDMA66. I have never used any DFI boards but I am told they are cheap and good. With Epox I have personal experience (both the board and the company) and I highly recommend them. Other than that I did not try to exclude any boards just mentioned the ones I've used and had good experience.

regards

[Peter M]

(sigh) the Epox G5 is an ATX board - and Epox BAT offering MVP3C2 has a measly 512 KB cache yet still is more expensive than the DFI in 2 MB version.

Sure, in ATX form factor there are a few more choices, but the DFIs still are the only ones with official K6 "+" support.

Regards, Peter

[bdunn]

I think I have a socket 8 board with that chipset but there are no 7s.

[c3p0-11n]

Enough said about SS7
Pete in your assessment of the chip evaluation, the via has developed well in a short time. Has the 440BX out lived its time? The abit be6-II (compared to the DFI PA61) offers DMA66. Will it is $30 higher it also will run 4 more dma's and leans more toward the future with PCI slots.

The L2 cache is on board memory? L1 cache is CPU memory? The more the better is easy to see

I have one other problem. When I am making a reply I have lost the scroll ability in my TOPIC REVIEW. socalgal suggested maybe something in IE or to read FAQ. I am still looking can anyone help

[Peter M]

440BX is showing its age in all aspects.
The 443BX north birdge cannot support today's large DIMMs, has only AGP 2x and no 133 MHz support on CPU and RAM busses.

The PIIX4e south bridge has only two USB ports, and no faster than UDMA33 IDE. Its low level of integration (no integrated super-IO, keyboard controller, sound, LAN, or modem) in turn keeps mainboard cost high.

VIAs current offering for Intel processors, the "Apollo 133A" combination of 694X and 686A/B chips, has it all - AGP 4x, independent speed selection of 66,100,133 for CPU and RAM, UDMA100 (with 686B), four USB ports, SIO, keyboard controller, sound and modem functions integrated.

Intel's current i815E offering has the same level of integration, yet is a lot more expensive and is still less capable as far as supported RAM goes.

But anyway, the entire P-III architecture is sort of old, and has hit its final ceiling at 1 GHz. Consider building an AMD Athlon or Duron based system - VIA has a very similar and well working chipset for those, and the architecture is new and has lots of headroom.

Regards, Peter

PS: With Pentium-III or Athlon architecture, all the caches are in the CPU.

[Jmc_uk]

Yo, c3p0

Go for a FIC mobo and a Duron 650 if ya want stable + cheap

Go for a Abit KT7 and a T-Bird 850 if ya want Overclocking but expensive

Go for a Jetway mobo and a Duron 750 if ya want cheap, all i one stuff and stable

[c3p0-11n]

Thanks for the advice Pete http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif Sounds like experience to me. That will be with the KX133

Jmc-uk thanks to for the break down. I will look at the FIC MB some but I like the creditability of the abit

Darn my battery back up just saved my a**

Yaul have a good day Bruce

[Peter M]

KT133 (or KT133A) and Socket A is what you want, not KX133 and Slot A. The slot architecture is on its way out at both AMD and Intel. Unless you want to build a box that's cheap and fast right now, with little or no need for upgrades, avoid.

Regards, Peter

[c3p0-11n]

Thanks to all the help I have narrowed it down to the dealer-duron 750-SB Value live-3dfx 3000- !!!!

But how do I decide on the motherboard Their are at least 6 boards that only change the overall price $30. I mean I am spending $360.00 max over $330.00 with that then it is down to 2 boards ABIT or ASUS or should I save the $30 for some more ram?

suggestions please or insight or experience


Found something I can get it down to $308 if I go with the DFI AK-74 SC MB

Now is the real question??? ARE these boards so different????

[This message has been edited by c3p0-11n (edited 11-04-2000).]

[Peter M]

I've recently used the DFI. Nothing to complain about. Runs Linux, is stable and fast, it's on AMD's Recommended Mainboards list.

Just for the sake of it, wait a couple of weeks and get the updated AK74EC, replacing the VIA 686A south bridge with the new 686B for UDMA100 IDE - or wait a bit longer to get an even newer revision that uses the officially-133-MHz-CPU-capable KT133A north bridge. (All other board makers do the same, so "right now" is not a good time to buy an Athlon board.)

Regards, Peter

[c3p0-11n]

That sounds good. I can wait. the ak74 looked good in a toms testing and with the onboard sound I can save on not buying a SC will the DFI run $30 less then the Asus. I need to check some on it overclocking steps. Can you link me up to where I check on the updating of the boards?

I have just started this PC stuff and read about a lot of mods. Like using the line out for amped sound and even changing the line in to line out. Where does one look for these mods? What is the minimum for the sound chip? I want to game with 3d sound.

I have used the sysopt guide to pick my suppliers. Not many of the reliable com. sell DFI. Can you (Pete) suggest one or more?

Gee pete you work at a neet place!

[This message has been edited by c3p0-11n (edited 11-05-2000).]

[Peter M]

DFI posted a new press release today.

They're replacing the 686A with the 686B on all their boards that use it, _and_ they'll replace the KT133 with the KT133A right afterwards.

What that means is that you better wait for an AK74AC to appear. The original SC has KT133/686A, the SC has KT133/686B, and the AC has KT133A/686B. (They all have the no-extra-cost onboard two-channel sound.)

Regards, Peter

[c3p0-11n]

Guten Tag, Peter

The kt133a is for the future cpu that will run at 133mhz and the 686b is for 100ide

I will keep checking at pricewatch !

I guess I can wait a couple of weeks. I am hopping this system will help my game. I try to play Delta Force and a new version is coming out on Wednesday. I think I have good enough equipment but my cpu is letting me down. That sounds like a good excuse to build a new computer right.

I have a yeild sign at the bottom of my IE window that says "Done,but with errors on page" Know what this means? Is the prob in my PC or IE?

Auf Wiedersehen Bruce

[JayMan]

about the error on page i also get the same thing, if you look at the error details the page seems to be missing a ")" in the source.

JayMan

[c3p0-11n]

JayMan ? There is no fix for this error?

In one of my win98se installes when I was posting a reply I could scroll through the Topic Review as I was typing my reply and read the other replies. Does this fuction work in your system are do you know where I need to check to fix it in mine?

Thanks Bruce

[Sliver]

Peter- about the 440BX chipset- I personally use and love my aBit BE6-2 , and my local computer store , which is really the best here in Salt Lake , swears by the BX , and uses it exclusively in their new systems. Do you think that the advances ABit has made with the BX , (133 fSB , 4X AGP, as seen in the new BX133 RAID)have breathed new life into this perrennial favorite?...C3PO- I dont know what the problem is with your IE , but Ill bet if you try Netscape your troubles will disappear!!

[Peter M]

The 440BX does not have AGP 4x, with no way to add it. 133 MHz FSB support also isn't there - besides the chip not being designed for it, which does compromise signal quality on the SDRAM bus, AGP frequency is screwed then (89 MHz instead of 66).

Like it or not, i440BX is an old chipset. I personally consider "BX133" mainboards a joke.

Regards, Peter

[c3p0-11n]

Peter

Monarch says 2 weeks for the AK74-AC

Can a person track down the manufactor of a bord by the chipsets or is there something else one needs. I understand how to do it with the numbers at the bottom of the startup screen.

Bruce

PS With my problem with the scroll. I have found that it is tool-internet options-advanced. I set that back to default and now I can open the topic file in another window. I will have to read in there some.

[Peter M]

Obviously, you can't identify a board by the chips used - they're the same for any maker who uses them. Only those makers that insist on getting rebadged chips with funny names, like Soyo and PC-Chips did in the past, give away their brand from what's written on the chips.

The "other" method (the most reliable being the BIOS ID as you know) would be through the FCC ID.

Regards, Peter