Socalgal..Just when you thought it was safe :-)

[Mntsnow]

FYI, This makes for some interesting reading. www.msnbc.com/local/rtut/2569.asp (I have disabled the link as it has expired but down a few posts there are others that relate to this!)

I sure dont like the idea of it!

Mntsnow

[This message has been edited by Mntsnow (edited 10-13-99).]

[drdeath]

WHAT A BUNCH OF BULL-HOCKEY-S&*T!!!!

thats all i have to say about it....

[This message has been edited by drdeath (edited 10-12-99).]

[Dominus]

Actually it's not. It's part of the specifications for IPv6. All internet communications will have a serial number based on the special MAC address of all new conectivity hardware sold.

I don't have a link to back it up (yet)...

~EDIT - Links:

Article http://www.techweb.com/se/directlink.cgi?INW19991004S0052

Slashdot Article

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=99/10/07/1322244&mode=thread

[This message has been edited by Dominus (edited 10-12-99).]

[socalgal]

Included in EUI-64 are two interesting pieces of information: the registered manufacturer of your NIC card and your 48-bit Ethernet address. Surprise!

Every packet you send out onto the public Internet using IPv6 has your fingerprints on it. And unlike your IP address under IPv4, which you can change, this address is embedded in your hardware. Permanently.

The spooks and weirdos in Washington, ever eager to empower the surveillance state as they fight a rear-guard action against strong encryption, must be thrilled with such a gift. They appear so thrilled that the Institute for Information Sciences, heavily funded by the Defense Department, is writing a reference stack for IPv6 that it is quietly hoping to slip into Windows 2000.

Uh oh. We are being assimilated!

Every card we use has a magnetic strip on it with our information. If you use a rewards or club savings card at a supermarket, they are gathering info about you and sharing it. (Altho there is a supposedly a new law in CA that will supposedly be stopping this). DMV/Law Enforcement cameras take snapshots of our cars and license plate numbers as we drive through an intersection. Every word ever typed online is archived. Certain keywords are filtered and studied. The government has a insatiable appetite to know everything about all.

I really don't hold much hope anymore of anything remaining private. "1984" is just a little later than Orwell predicted, isn't it. Intel doesn't care, they still produce their PSNs and now the NIC cards. MS is in cahoots with the NSA.

New security holes and privacy identifiers seem to be discovered pretty frequently. It makes me wonder how much we don't still know about.

How can we fight such controls? The EPIC and other such groups (what ever happened to UCITA? -who never got back in touch with me after several requests for documentation) - what are they really doing to fight this?

Sounds like PGP may be the only hope we have, or is it?


[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-12-99).]

[nilknarf]

Who was it that said it would never happen?!

It has taken longer than some of us expected, but the government is finally applying technologies and techniques that have been around for quite some time now.

As for what we can do about such controls, don't use the tehnologies on which they are based. Of course, it may be difficult for some of us to give up our credit cards and automobiles!
/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by nilknarf (edited 10-12-99).]

[rl]

for some reason the word paranoid keeps popping into my head while i read this post, just chill out, if you have ever seen a episode of mtv's "downtown", you all are reminding me of the guy who wheres the spiked shoulder pads. who cares if they see what i do? i could give a horses putoot if the whole world watches everything i do on a giant tv /forum/smile.gif /forum/smile.gif

orwells 1984??? dont you think that is a little much? i mean do you honestly think that the government cares what any of you do?? if they DID care then why would they send hundreds of us to war to be killed, they dont care what we do as long as it does not effect them, or anyone they are affiliated with. i have two points to make here: 1) look at it in perspective of the real world, there are millions of people who live in the US, probly at the most 20% are on the internet at a given time, that is still millions and millions of people on at once, i would LOVE to see the governments hidden computer that can keep track of every single person at any given time on the internet, it wouldnt happen, they would spend there money to spy on foreign nations not ours.
2) once they have built up this giant mass of information what are they going to do with it??? it would be 99% pointless to do this, the one percent might possible be when a person is in trouble with the law he would be easy to catch, but even that is not true, proved by the mass of criminals who get away every year. not starting any flames, i just get frustrated when things are taken so far out of proportion
rl


[This message has been edited by rl (edited 10-12-99).]

[Bronco]

The safest place for all that information is in the government.

Can we spell bureaucracy?

[smokin1]

I couldn't help but jump in here. rl you have some good points and there is no flame coming from this guy. The beautiful thing about America is the perception that you are free to do as you wish...I for one do not want to have every move I make tracked by someone who has arbitrarily chosen a "hot word" that I may inadvertently use while anywhere on the web. I have shown in a previous post that EVERYTHING that is done on the web is being archived for "the future". Your digital being has already been saved to a tape drive. I don't break the law while on the web, but there are certainly places that I have been in search of security information that would place me in a group I do not belong to. Why would I want or need to be harrassed for the simple act of seeking information? The idea of the article is so misguided that I have to throw my hands in the air and ask WHY? If you really want to be bad on the net all you have to do is go to the library and use their computer. To me the whole idea IS to pry into what the little guy is doing because this would certainly not have any effect what so ever on a reasonably capable computer user.
2c
/forum/wink.gif

[Vampiel]

Thats it first INTEL wants serial #'s, they get SUED DA f*@K out of and now the US gov'd wants dis!!! what about other countries the net is worldwide ya know!!!!! !AAHH AWJIO{EU*Q@*)# F*@K* S*@&$ BASTERDS!! A bussiness cant do it but they same gov that outlawed it for that computer company can? WTF!!!! wipp out the BIG BLACK DILDO AND BENT OVER! pardon my french but this kinda stuff just pisses me off and I cant do a fr8kn thing! |(
Ohh and RL, no one said that the GOV got ALL THE INFO, just that it was sent to anywhere/whatever web site you goto, witch if the situation came up the gov could access it, its not like they moniter you all the time, its like this
say I go to the CIA home page, a hacker hacks the page at the same time im on, since my fingerprint is on it then they trace back to me, the hacker knows this fingerprint is there and makes it look like I did it and they dont even know he was there, im just browsing and not worrying about anything, then boom FBI bla bla jail buuhhhh, wtfever this is BULL! America has forgotten the BASIS of its foundation for the relentless persuit of technology and there image.... freedom what has happened, keep this up and we will just become another country in the history books that failed, if there is EVEN history books by the time its over with.

[This message has been edited by Vampiel (edited 10-13-99).]

[cwizard]

I guess people that don't care about their privacy don't care that overseas long distance phone calls have been recorded since the 1940s and that domestic long distance calls are also recorded. In the past, they used special, large reel, slow speed tape machines to do it and people to listen to them. Now, it's automated with voice recognition. Or have you been instructed to speak your account # lately?

Personally, I don't pry into other people's business and I don't want them snooping on mine. For those of you that don't care, maybe you could get a situation like in The Truman Show.

[Mai Oh Mai]

One point to remember: 'Everything you say can (and will porbably) be used in court against you'. But for this to be implemented, somebody has to get evidence in the first place--that's where 'invasion of privacy' comes into play. Beyond trying to get info to make money (target marketing), evidence can always be 'saved/archived' for future use against any potential 'agitators'. The police are told that 'All citizens are potential criminals'. Unfortunately too many ppl would rather trade Constitutional rights for more so-called security. E-commerce issues are a smoke-screen to cover potentially damaging policies to the Bill of Rights. No autocratic government trusts its citizens--so-called state security is of more importance to Big Brother than individual rights.

[alondra]

VAMPIEL
I do not excuse your french. It is not french, of which I have some knowlege, but uncalled for vulgarity. If you can repost in a decent manner I will then read your post.

[alondra]

we recently found out that the supermarkets were compiling data on your purchases, with those Club Cards. It is theorized that a lawyer could bring up the purchases of liquor, in a liability case. say you sliped and fell in their store. not really to far fetched today.

[cwizard]

The use of the Debit card is to track what you do. They have been surreptiously promoting these things as a convenience. The real purpose is to attach a ss# with a database. So what? Well, suppose you wanted to make a large amount of fudge for your social club and purchased a lot of sugar. Then, unrelated, you purchased a large amount of wheat shorts to feed migrating birds. And at the same time, you decided to install that heat exchanger unit that required a great deal of copper tubing.

All this may seem inconsequencial to you but in the part of the country where I grew up, merchants were regularly visited by agents and asked these questions. I'll let you figure out why.

Anyway, this is just one example of how someone compiling information on you can be misinterpreted and create unnecessary harrassment.

It goes without saying that e-commerce has this danger now. But extend it to website surfing for simple information gathering.

I'm reminded of the scene from the movie Head Office where Judge Reinhold is writing up a proposal to save the Allenville plant on the company word processor. Everything is being monitored by "Security". As he types in the outline, it is determined by "Security" with the help of a jealous fellow employee that his Allenville report is UnAmerican.

George Orwell was distressingly on target; the British culture has become monitored just like he predicted. Cameras are everywhere. Have you noticed that cameras are showing up outside here too?

[This message has been edited by cwizard (edited 10-13-99).]

[rl]

what do you guys think?? that the government is a giant conspiracy, and the whole goal is to track each and every one of us??? honestly why would they care???????, it makes no sense to track people for the sake of tracking them, if they did this then why do they not catch every internet peodofile(sp?)?????? and stop cerial killers before they kill by tips they have show on the web?? BECAUSE THEY DONT CARE! it is to much time and money they could be spending on other more impotant things, like acctualy protecting us so we stay free. my .02$ (again) rl

[cwizard]

****

[This message has been edited by cwizard (edited 10-13-99).]

[rl]

i did not mean conspiracy in the sense of elvis isnt dead kind of thing, what i mean is the governments master plan to follow us. the only reason that they would want to pick up on key words would possibly be to catch terrorists or drug smugglers. but how do you know for sure that it is hard fact?? if they have been using this system then nothing they are doing is working. i will be satified and not reply any more on this thread (maybee) if someone can give me one GOOD reason they would want all of this information on you me or any other joe on the street. /forum/smile.gif

[Bronco]

Can we spell parinoid?

I can't /forum/wink.gif

[MrEd]

OK, all I wanted to do is see what all the hoopla was about, so I click on the URL, and get a MSN page "File not found". Ummm, did I miss something?

-MrEd
/forum/smile.gif

[socalgal]

I just got the same 404 too at the msn site.

There's an article here http://www.cnn.com/TECH/computing/9910/12/internet.privacy.ap/index.html that gives you the idea, although it's not as detailed as Mnstnow's link.

[Mntsnow]

Yep, the link is now broken...thats what I hate about some of the news sites...They put it up for a couple of days and then trash it!

Mntsnow

[U-96]

Ah the beauty of the Internet...

"I saw this mitigating evidence/really cool article/great story at www.????.com... oh it's gone."

For this reason no-one will ever write a good history of internet content. Until people responsibly archive their content, knowledge will be lost as soon as it is gained.
On the other hand...
Governments hack into opposition group websites. Stories appear, misinform, malign and foment, then disappear, but the harm has been done.

All it needs is a rumour to start a revolution in an unstable country. The Americans, British, French and Russians (among others) have been doing it for years!

Governments are at the mercy of multinational corporations. Society is a fabrication designed to create consumers.
Problem is, I can't decide whether to surrender to the Matrix, or buy a pair of those sunglasses that let me see the alien doppelgangers. /forum/wink.gif

U-96

[U-96]

Having just written the above post, I pick up today's Guardian newspaper, and read this article:

http://www.newsunlimited.co.uk/online/story/0,3605,91691,00.html

If that doesn't work (was originally cookiefied), go here:
www.guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk)
then scroll down to "The papers" section and under Guardian, click "Online", then scroll to "Is Big Brother Watching You?"

Sorry if these links die. I'll try to cut and paste the text before it does.

U-96

P.S.: terrorism, CIA, MI5, Mossad, bomb, fertilizer, KKK, Hezbollah, fraud, cocaine, Medellin, dollar, airplane, Roswell, Athens, Israel, PLO, detonator, alarm clock, Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

That should keep someone in a job for the rest of the day.


[This message has been edited by U-96 (edited 10-14-99).]

[socalgal]

Yes, that should keep them occupied!

http://www.seasurf.com/~radioman/nsaec.html



[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-14-99).]

[alondra]

cameras/ licence plates. just saw an add for a gadget you put over your plate, that normally does not effect seeing it. but from angles, like where a camera would be it is unreadable. remember, Newton, said "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction" /forum/smile.gif ( present day school students, ask your Dad)

[Vampiel]

Well it is not like they "track" you. You know that they know have the technology to make a gun that picks up the electro-magnetic freq. of an object, like an oscillator, but on a gun, just point and boom, they can know what color your underwear is, how much money you have and whatever else you may have on you (although I would hope that they would prog. it to come up with only illigal objects) alhtough they will prob. still prog. it to come up with how much $$ you have, I saw it on discovery channel and cops are supposed to be starting to use them planned about 5yrs. If it comes to this, im just gonna carry a magnet in pocket *SUCK ON THAT |)* The point is privacy, not to mention there is a liscence you can get that makes it legal for you to carry concealed weapons. btw if any one has a revoked/suspended liscence go here : drive.newmail.ru/ (http://drive.newmail.ru/)
If I wanna buy a TV/GUN/STEREO I dont want a record of it that FBI can pull up if im convicted of something. This leads to false accusations/witch means innocent jail time.


[This message has been edited by Vampiel (edited 10-15-99).]

[alondra]

there was a story out a while back, that there was a detector to check for the little ID strip in the $20 bills. and they had one like a metal detector that if you walked thru could count them. of course the justification there, would to stop drug money. Ha!

[smokin1]

Well Alondra..if there is such a program...I wish they would install it at my regular border crossing..It could save US Customs a LOT of time....specially on me
/forum/frown.gif