Mal
08-09-2001, 02:06 PM
I just bought a new mouse that came with a USB plug, but with a PS/2 adapter. Which one is better, the PS/2 or USB.
Click to See Complete Forum and Search --> : Mice: USB vs. PS/2
Target
08-09-2001, 02:13 PM
.
[This message has been edited by Target (edited 08-10-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Target (edited 08-10-2001).]
VERT
08-09-2001, 02:21 PM
USB any day
Mal
08-09-2001, 02:42 PM
I've switched to USB. I heard somewhere that USB mice aren't supported in safe mode.
narayan
08-09-2001, 02:59 PM
That's why they have the ps/2 adapter.
Cody
08-09-2001, 03:15 PM
I have found that, if you are a gamer, PS/2 is a better choice... it seems most games run faster (more stable?) with a PS/2 vs. USB.
Just my experience though.
Oh, BTW: In WinMe, T2 wouldn't run with my mouse as USB, but fine with PS/2... Windows 2000 (My Current OS) runs slightly better with PS/2 than USB.
Just my experience though.
Oh, BTW: In WinMe, T2 wouldn't run with my mouse as USB, but fine with PS/2... Windows 2000 (My Current OS) runs slightly better with PS/2 than USB.
OuTpaTienT
08-09-2001, 03:20 PM
Definitely PS/2. Especially if you're a gamer.
What brand of mouse? Many (Logitech for one) will allow you to raise the PS/2 port sampling rate in the driver properties. If you can, raise it to at least 100 or all the way up to 200 samples/sec.
If you can't raise the sampling rate for the PS/2 port, then you might be better off with USB which has a sampling rate of 125 samples/sec. (non-adjustable).
What brand of mouse? Many (Logitech for one) will allow you to raise the PS/2 port sampling rate in the driver properties. If you can, raise it to at least 100 or all the way up to 200 samples/sec.
If you can't raise the sampling rate for the PS/2 port, then you might be better off with USB which has a sampling rate of 125 samples/sec. (non-adjustable).
NDD
08-09-2001, 03:35 PM
I like the smooth move of USB mouse, but in CPU intensive games PS/2 might actually perfrom better.
Donno, have 1 GHz T-Bird and Intellimouse Explorer USB Optical, and never faced any problem, not even with 100% CPU load.
Best Regards ...
Donno, have 1 GHz T-Bird and Intellimouse Explorer USB Optical, and never faced any problem, not even with 100% CPU load.
Best Regards ...
RamonGTP
08-09-2001, 03:45 PM
I've been wondering th same thing, I have a Microsoft optical USB mouse with a PS/2 adapter and I wasn't sure which would be the better choice, looks like its about 50/50
-Ramon
-Ramon
Mal
08-09-2001, 05:10 PM
I have a Logitech optical mouse. I've tried it both on USB and PS/2 and I haven't noticed much of a difference on Win2k.
RamonGTP
08-09-2001, 05:21 PM
So why is it that gamers should use the PS/2 port as opposed to the USB?
-Ramon
-Ramon
Brian48
08-09-2001, 07:10 PM
So why is it that gamers should use the PS/2 port as opposed to the USB?
Because when used at default hz settings, the PS2 uses less CPU cycles, thus leaving more available cycles for the game to use.
Now here's the argument. Unless you're using a really old Pentium class processor, I'd doubt you'd notice the difference.
The whole point of using a USB mouse is that it refreshs much faster than a standard PS2, 120hz for USB, 40hz for PS2 under Win9x (60hz for WinNT). This helps eliminate the "jerky" motion felt sometimes when playing some first person shooters. This occurs when the game is run on a really fast machine and the framerate is so high, the mouse has a hard time keeping up. In this regard, the USB fairs much better and feels much "smoother". Although faster than PS2, the USB DOES use more CPU cycles as a result.
Although the PS2 refresh rate is standard at 40hz, there are software utilities out there that allow you to change this. The popular PS2rate allows you to bump the refresh rate all the way up to 200hz which is even faster than USB. Logitech mice (since Mouseware v8.32) come with an adjustable refresh rate option by default, but you may need to enable it in the registry for some models. Microsoft Intellimouse software drivers default at 100hz for PS2 as well. Win2k also defaults at 100hz for PS2.
Now this raises another question. Since PS2 can be pushed to be just as fast as USB, why not go PS2 and save the IRQ? Well, you have to remember, this hz adjustment is done in software. The higher you set it, the more CPU cycle it eats up. What you gain from using the PS2 over the USB is quickly losted and you're back to square one.
Bottomline regarding PS2 vs USB? Not a **** bit of difference. Use what you're comfortable with.
[This message has been edited by Brian48 (edited 08-10-2001).]
Because when used at default hz settings, the PS2 uses less CPU cycles, thus leaving more available cycles for the game to use.
Now here's the argument. Unless you're using a really old Pentium class processor, I'd doubt you'd notice the difference.
The whole point of using a USB mouse is that it refreshs much faster than a standard PS2, 120hz for USB, 40hz for PS2 under Win9x (60hz for WinNT). This helps eliminate the "jerky" motion felt sometimes when playing some first person shooters. This occurs when the game is run on a really fast machine and the framerate is so high, the mouse has a hard time keeping up. In this regard, the USB fairs much better and feels much "smoother". Although faster than PS2, the USB DOES use more CPU cycles as a result.
Although the PS2 refresh rate is standard at 40hz, there are software utilities out there that allow you to change this. The popular PS2rate allows you to bump the refresh rate all the way up to 200hz which is even faster than USB. Logitech mice (since Mouseware v8.32) come with an adjustable refresh rate option by default, but you may need to enable it in the registry for some models. Microsoft Intellimouse software drivers default at 100hz for PS2 as well. Win2k also defaults at 100hz for PS2.
Now this raises another question. Since PS2 can be pushed to be just as fast as USB, why not go PS2 and save the IRQ? Well, you have to remember, this hz adjustment is done in software. The higher you set it, the more CPU cycle it eats up. What you gain from using the PS2 over the USB is quickly losted and you're back to square one.
Bottomline regarding PS2 vs USB? Not a **** bit of difference. Use what you're comfortable with.
[This message has been edited by Brian48 (edited 08-10-2001).]
yammahoppy
08-09-2001, 07:23 PM
heck i have one of each hooked up right now. when i got my usb optical mouse i never unplugged the ps2 mouse and they both work. i use the usb one though cause it has more buttons.
the yamminator
the yamminator
Warthog
08-09-2001, 08:25 PM
Thanks for the awesome explanation Brian!
I use USB. I was about to say I don't notice a single difference in games when switching from PS/2 to USB.
I use USB because I can unplug it while the comp is running to untangle my cord.
Warthog
I use USB. I was about to say I don't notice a single difference in games when switching from PS/2 to USB.
I use USB because I can unplug it while the comp is running to untangle my cord.
Warthog
OuTpaTienT
08-09-2001, 09:28 PM
Sorry Brian, don't mean to be argumentative but you're a little off on some of those theories.
Changing the refresh Hz of the PS/2 port is a hardware setting. The software (ps2rate or the mouse drivers) simply change the hardware setting, but once they perform that change they are no longer active, and the port is physically running at whatever Hz you set it at (just as if you changed a jumper or something like that). So there is not an additional software layer as you say.
--
I'm fairly positive that the refresh rate of a USB mouse is 125hz.
--
And I didn't suggest using the PS/2 port over USB because of used clock cycles. In my experience, the PS/2 port is simply rock stable and ALWAYS works. On my machine as well as almost all others I've tried, a USB mouse can have minor little idiosyncrasies that are easily overlooked in the Windoze environment but in a fast paced game can get you killed.
For example, on my machine the mouse seems to work flawlessly when connected to the USB port. Even in games it seems just great, for a while. But every so often, when I try to jump & spin, it'll not respond quick enough and instead of jumping & spinning I end up hopping & turning. It doesn't happen often, maybe only once every 50 or 75 times I try the move...but using the PS/2 port it doesn't ever happen.
USB is just great for devices you have to connect or disconnect on the fly, but for something like a mouse that's always connected to your computer, the USB is not necessary. And why waste a perfectly good PS/2 port? And remember, all the USB devices share the USB bandwidth, so more items connected to it mean shrinking USB bandwidth.
Changing the refresh Hz of the PS/2 port is a hardware setting. The software (ps2rate or the mouse drivers) simply change the hardware setting, but once they perform that change they are no longer active, and the port is physically running at whatever Hz you set it at (just as if you changed a jumper or something like that). So there is not an additional software layer as you say.
--
I'm fairly positive that the refresh rate of a USB mouse is 125hz.
--
And I didn't suggest using the PS/2 port over USB because of used clock cycles. In my experience, the PS/2 port is simply rock stable and ALWAYS works. On my machine as well as almost all others I've tried, a USB mouse can have minor little idiosyncrasies that are easily overlooked in the Windoze environment but in a fast paced game can get you killed.
For example, on my machine the mouse seems to work flawlessly when connected to the USB port. Even in games it seems just great, for a while. But every so often, when I try to jump & spin, it'll not respond quick enough and instead of jumping & spinning I end up hopping & turning. It doesn't happen often, maybe only once every 50 or 75 times I try the move...but using the PS/2 port it doesn't ever happen.
USB is just great for devices you have to connect or disconnect on the fly, but for something like a mouse that's always connected to your computer, the USB is not necessary. And why waste a perfectly good PS/2 port? And remember, all the USB devices share the USB bandwidth, so more items connected to it mean shrinking USB bandwidth.
samwichse
08-09-2001, 09:47 PM
I agree with Out, I've never had a single problem with a PS/2 mouse (unless it was broken of course http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif), but USB is nothing but trouble.
The best reason to use PS/2? Because then you leave your other USB ports all open. Why waste one on something your computer has a port built specifically to take?
EDIT: on a side note, what's up with USB speakers?
[This message has been edited by samwichse (edited 08-09-2001).]
The best reason to use PS/2? Because then you leave your other USB ports all open. Why waste one on something your computer has a port built specifically to take?
EDIT: on a side note, what's up with USB speakers?
[This message has been edited by samwichse (edited 08-09-2001).]
Mr Miyagi
08-10-2001, 03:40 AM
On my desktop, I use PS/2. The other desktop I just dismantled, I used USB because the PS/2 stopped working. THe mouse is a Belkin Aerocruiser USB with PS/2 adapter. Now I use it on my laptop when I use it at the desk. On the now dismantled system (K6-2 400) the USB ran smooth, but jerked and paused when there was heavy disk access. I use it USB on the laptop because I can yank it while its on, and when I plug it in the laptop's PS/2 port, the scroll wheel won't function. No jerkiness in laptop. I guess they each have advantages, and disadvantages.
jad1097
08-10-2001, 04:26 AM
Ps/2 simply because it is a pain to change it from USB to PS/2 when needed.
Brian48
08-10-2001, 07:16 AM
Sorry Brian, don't mean to be argumentative but you're a little off on some of those theories.
No offense taken. I apologize for not being clear. By the nature of my work, I lump all software induced changes like this (via drivers or otherwise) all under software since the end result is the same and the OS (which is software) now behaves differently. I am well aware there is no software layer active in resident memory once this "reset" has taken place. My point is, when you raise the hz level of the PS2, you are losing one of major selling points brought up in these discussions of the PS2 over USB. You gain no advantage in terms of reduced CPU cycles. In some cases, it may be even more CPU intensive if you raise it too high.
--------------
I am not going to quibble over a 5 hz difference. Regarding the hz rate 120hz, this is what I have read in several, in-print articles from various PC magazines and online sites. Considering the numerous references to this setting, this is the one I use for conversation. No doubt that in actuality, the real hz rating is slightly variable and is derived based on the fact that the MAX transfer rate for full speed USB devices is 12mb/s (1.5mb/s for low speed devices).
--------------
I did not mean to single you out personally, but I wanted to make sure the all the facts regarding CPU usage is clear. Sure, your argument that PS2 is better for gaming because it's more consistent is valid, but that is usually never the issue that everyone harps on with these PS2 vs USB debates.
I personally don't advocate one over the other. Each has got it's own advantages. True, USB pointing devices has some quirks, espcially those annoying pauses whenever starting/running mulitple applications at once, however this is generally not a problem when running a single application (like a game). There should be nothing wrong with using a USB mouse provided that the OS is stable and resources are managed correctly. By the way, the trouble you've described used to happen to me as well, but a combination of speed adjustments and a better mouse surface corrected the problem completely (I have an Intellimouse Optical).
PS2 has got it's quirks as well. Especially when used with a mouse that would normally run via USB port. Many of the popular "optical" mice from MS, Logitech, and others do not always run properly when used with a PS2 adapter and often display jerky or erratic behavior, maybe not in games, but definitely in Windows desktop. This is not something that is reproducable with every system, but I've seen it often enough to know that it exists.
Also, not using the PS2 port for your primary pointing device is not a waste. I see no reason why you can't use both. True bandwidth is shared with the USB, this only becomes an issue if you're running all your USB devices simultaneously, which is doubtful during gaming.
With that said, I can't say either one is superior to the other because it's not. You need to try BOTH to see which one works the best for your individual system and tastes. Just be sure that you choose one over the other for right reasons and not because "someone else said so".
[This message has been edited by Brian48 (edited 08-10-2001).]
No offense taken. I apologize for not being clear. By the nature of my work, I lump all software induced changes like this (via drivers or otherwise) all under software since the end result is the same and the OS (which is software) now behaves differently. I am well aware there is no software layer active in resident memory once this "reset" has taken place. My point is, when you raise the hz level of the PS2, you are losing one of major selling points brought up in these discussions of the PS2 over USB. You gain no advantage in terms of reduced CPU cycles. In some cases, it may be even more CPU intensive if you raise it too high.
--------------
I am not going to quibble over a 5 hz difference. Regarding the hz rate 120hz, this is what I have read in several, in-print articles from various PC magazines and online sites. Considering the numerous references to this setting, this is the one I use for conversation. No doubt that in actuality, the real hz rating is slightly variable and is derived based on the fact that the MAX transfer rate for full speed USB devices is 12mb/s (1.5mb/s for low speed devices).
--------------
I did not mean to single you out personally, but I wanted to make sure the all the facts regarding CPU usage is clear. Sure, your argument that PS2 is better for gaming because it's more consistent is valid, but that is usually never the issue that everyone harps on with these PS2 vs USB debates.
I personally don't advocate one over the other. Each has got it's own advantages. True, USB pointing devices has some quirks, espcially those annoying pauses whenever starting/running mulitple applications at once, however this is generally not a problem when running a single application (like a game). There should be nothing wrong with using a USB mouse provided that the OS is stable and resources are managed correctly. By the way, the trouble you've described used to happen to me as well, but a combination of speed adjustments and a better mouse surface corrected the problem completely (I have an Intellimouse Optical).
PS2 has got it's quirks as well. Especially when used with a mouse that would normally run via USB port. Many of the popular "optical" mice from MS, Logitech, and others do not always run properly when used with a PS2 adapter and often display jerky or erratic behavior, maybe not in games, but definitely in Windows desktop. This is not something that is reproducable with every system, but I've seen it often enough to know that it exists.
Also, not using the PS2 port for your primary pointing device is not a waste. I see no reason why you can't use both. True bandwidth is shared with the USB, this only becomes an issue if you're running all your USB devices simultaneously, which is doubtful during gaming.
With that said, I can't say either one is superior to the other because it's not. You need to try BOTH to see which one works the best for your individual system and tastes. Just be sure that you choose one over the other for right reasons and not because "someone else said so".
[This message has been edited by Brian48 (edited 08-10-2001).]
Nick CPU
08-10-2001, 07:25 AM
I''ll do anything this guy says!! http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif
[This message has been edited by Nick CPU (edited 08-10-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Nick CPU (edited 08-10-2001).]
gfunkmartin
08-10-2001, 08:43 AM
I prefer PS/2. I just like it better. I'm not a huge fan of USB, it tends to be iffy sometimes.
Warthog
08-10-2001, 10:24 AM
Not saying anyone is wrong at all, I've never had any problems with using my Intellimouse Explorer USB for games.
Go with what you feel is good for you, as Brian said. If you have had troubles with USB like Out, use PS/2. Or if you don't notice a difference like me....toss a coin http://www.sysopt.com/forum/wink.gif
Also, I don't have any other USB devices besides a joystick I don't use..oh, and a scanner. When I get a digitalcamera, I will most likely put my mouse back on PS/2.
Warthog
Go with what you feel is good for you, as Brian said. If you have had troubles with USB like Out, use PS/2. Or if you don't notice a difference like me....toss a coin http://www.sysopt.com/forum/wink.gif
Also, I don't have any other USB devices besides a joystick I don't use..oh, and a scanner. When I get a digitalcamera, I will most likely put my mouse back on PS/2.
Warthog
AuraEdge
08-10-2001, 11:29 AM
USB for me, coz it plugs into my keyboard http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif
Also one of my friends accedentally shorted out his motherboard when he pulled out his PS/2 mouse when the comp was on. As wayward as my wires are, that could happen to me. Dont have that problem with USB - thier hot swappable.
Also one of my friends accedentally shorted out his motherboard when he pulled out his PS/2 mouse when the comp was on. As wayward as my wires are, that could happen to me. Dont have that problem with USB - thier hot swappable.
hallam2003
08-10-2001, 01:23 PM
well, after reading this seamingly endless squable of ****. I tend to belive that the USB/PS2 war is to be determined on a personal basis. regardless of hardware/software differences or "betternesses," the fact is that everyone has their onw individule wishes or needs. also, each computer system, depending on config, may "like" one of the other. as for me, I've had some problem with my ps2 being a little choppy in the windows environment, but it seams to work fine under gaming. on the other hand, i sarted using a USB, and it worked just fine under both applications. And since the majority of us here are using ungodly fast and powerfull machines, I don;t see why we're arguing over the few extra cycles one may have over the other. Although I use a USB on my ssytem, I found the a friends computer, which i built, that was fairly similar to mine, "likes" the PS2 better for whatever reason, so you know what i did? i used the ps2 on his, and the USB on mine, wow, what a concept. hhhmmm, this world is so hatefull, i think we all need a big ol' cyber-hug, wow, i think that's a new term, for me anyway.
Hallam
Hallam
Imperion1
08-10-2001, 04:18 PM
I'll stick with my PS2 port instead of USB. I'm using a Logitech optical wheel mouse, its a USB w/ PS2 connector. I don't have any problems with my mouse using the PS2 connector. Its also attached in conjunction w/ a 6ft PS2 extention cable.
japerritt
08-10-2001, 06:00 PM
USB ports iffy? I have never had one problem with my usb ports. I just switched back to PS2 cause I needed the USB port.
Warthog
08-10-2001, 11:26 PM
well, after reading this seamingly endless squable of ****. I tend to belive that the USB/PS2 war is to be determined on a personal basis
lol, so true. AMEN!
*gives hallam a cyber-hug*
hmmmmmmmm
*gives penelope cruz a cyber-hug*
*gives penelope cruz a cyber-hug, again*
I like it http://www.sysopt.com/forum/wink.gif
Warthog
lol, so true. AMEN!
*gives hallam a cyber-hug*
hmmmmmmmm
*gives penelope cruz a cyber-hug*
*gives penelope cruz a cyber-hug, again*
I like it http://www.sysopt.com/forum/wink.gif
Warthog
Spanky
08-10-2001, 11:42 PM
I use the Microsoft explorer, its USB but I use the USB > PS/2 converter.
Why? Cause the first time I went into safe mode and the mouse didn't work I got pissed.
I switched to PS/2 and I leave it there.
Plus since I don't have anything else pluged into USB I can just disable it in bios.
I do have a logitech joystick that can use USB with a gameport > USB converter included with the stick, but I found the stick isn't actually hotswapable and that I had to uninstall and reinstall the stick and software after unplugging it to get it to work again. Yet with the game port I can unplug and plug it back in at any time.
All in all I find USB is just not as cool as I once thought it was going to be, maybe someday when I buy a new printer, scanner or Camera I will use USB.
Why? Cause the first time I went into safe mode and the mouse didn't work I got pissed.
I switched to PS/2 and I leave it there.
Plus since I don't have anything else pluged into USB I can just disable it in bios.
I do have a logitech joystick that can use USB with a gameport > USB converter included with the stick, but I found the stick isn't actually hotswapable and that I had to uninstall and reinstall the stick and software after unplugging it to get it to work again. Yet with the game port I can unplug and plug it back in at any time.
All in all I find USB is just not as cool as I once thought it was going to be, maybe someday when I buy a new printer, scanner or Camera I will use USB.
Warthog
08-10-2001, 11:47 PM
Plus since I don't have anything else pluged into USB I can just disable it in bios.
Sorry if this sounds ignorant - what's the point of doing that? Does it increase starting time by .02 seconds?
Warthog
Sorry if this sounds ignorant - what's the point of doing that? Does it increase starting time by .02 seconds?
Warthog
OuTpaTienT
08-11-2001, 03:56 AM
To free up some resources...possibly a whole IRQ or at least it's shared portion of an IRQ.
KAknight
08-11-2001, 03:39 PM
I would use PS/2. It gives you an extra USB port. I can't tell any speed difference between the 2 when I am playing a game.
Spanky
08-11-2001, 03:53 PM
Exactly out, to free up IRQs and such.
Course the computer still shares all kinds of stuff.
I also disable my serial ports and the floppy drive controller
I do leave the printer port enabled cause I use a joystick adapter that uses that port.
Course the computer still shares all kinds of stuff.
I also disable my serial ports and the floppy drive controller
I do leave the printer port enabled cause I use a joystick adapter that uses that port.
shawnr
08-11-2001, 09:30 PM
What else are you going to use that PS2 port for? No sense in using up a perfectly good USB!
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