which motherboard should i get?

[oblivion81]

hi guys... new here.... i was thinking of replacing my old pc with a new one... and i only have problems selecting a perfect motherboard. which is where my weakness lies... i dont know much bout motherboards.

ok... most probably you guys would be wondering what is the pc for... rite... well intense gaming purposes and general stuff... long hours switch on... =)

i was thinking of going pentium 4, and was wondering which motherboard would be a great buy... basically they only sells asus, MSI, intel, gigabite, and a few more...

1)what are u guys talking bout OEM and stuff?
2)theres this spec on the board like 333 mhz, 400mhz and 533 mhz... does this has anything to do with the memory chips?

3)any site where i can learn more about motherboards?

[Baddog]

http://motherboards.org/ :t

[killer_teddy]

Hmmm... Pen-Tee-Um 4... Interesting concept.:p

What's the rest of the PC going to consist of?

[tantone]

If you have the $$ to spend, an 875P chipset (like the Asus P4C800-E Deluxe) would be best.

OEM: bulk part, usually only a 30-day warranty from the seller. You normally don't get manuals or any of the stuff you'd get if you went to a computer store and bought the retail item.
RETAIL: getting the full, boxed part with the full warranty (usually 3 years) and all of the trimmings it may come with

And the spec on the board (333, 533, 400) is the Front Side Bus speed, and yes, it has everything to do with memory. You'll need memory that's rated for the speed

[deadkenny]

The latest for the P4 is an FSB of 800MHz. In the past P4's ran at 533 and 400MHz FSB. The memory bus is separate, but you generally want it to run at the same speed as the FSB (or at least not too different). The 865 or 875 chipset would be the best choices for a P4 right now (the 875 being 'top of the line' and the 865 being a bit cheaper). ASUS would be a good choice (P4C800 or P4P800), but there are others, including Intel themselves, who offer very reliable / stable m/b's, but w/o much in the way of OC'ing options.

[TweakerXP]

.....and WELCOME TO SYSOPT!!!!!!:D

Please don't be afraid to ask questions !! :x

That's why we're here!!!:D

[oblivion81]

thanx for the welcome.

eventhough i did say extreme gaming... lol i'm not wiling to spend so much... cos it'll get out-dated in a year or two...

seems like everyone's suggesting 875p chipset... ill go check it out....
thanx for the suggestions ... appreciate it...

[spyman]

Why not an Amd board. Much cheaper and pretty close to the same performance. I would say that unless you have some sort of job that you use your pc for, that requires the best performance possible, Amd is the way to go. Or of course if your rich and money is no object go for an intel.
Heres a great gaming computer. Exellent value and should last for a good while.
Abit NF7-s ver.2

Athlonxp2500+

2x256 pc400 ram

ati9600pro or if you got more $ to spend 9800xt

What ever size hard drive you think you'll need with sata and 8mb cach.

any case with 350w. power sup. from a quality brand ie. antec(my personal fav.)

The latest liteon cdburner/dvd whatever speed their up to now or if you have the money or need get a dvdburner


a cheap floppy drive or if you have the need for a multi card reader they have 6 in one card/floppy drives for a cheap price.If you plan or have a digital camara, mp3 player or any other device that uses compact flash/secere digital/whatever, go for the muti reader/floppy drive, I wish I did.

Get what ever keyboard that you like and get whatever optical mouse that you like.

Top it all off with a 19' quality perfectly flat ctr monitor and some decent 5.1 speakers and your going to almost wet your pants the first time you load up your favorite graphic intensive action game.

And you'll still have saved a ton, that you could spend on new games or periferals.

Or you could spend more and have top bragging rights. But will you enjoy the games anymore?Are you going to be able to type faster? Will your printer print faster? I dout it. I don't know maybe I'm wrong having never owned a newer intel, the last being a p2-400. The performance can't be to much better for most people. I'm happy plenty with the performance from my AMD, but then again my pc is for pleasure only. If I had a job that I used my pc for, I would want the best performance that money could buy and that definately is intel.
Good luck. Hope I helped

:t :t

[Bigjakkstaffa]

Seconds the chopice of an Abit Nf7-S v2.0 armed with Athlon Xp2500+

--Jakk:t

[deadkenny]

If you're looking for good performance, but not necessarily the absolute fastest available, then an AMD socket A solution would be a good choice. Some people insist on sticking with Intel, but if you're willing to consider AMD then there are lot's of options.

[oblivion81]

sata and 8mb cach?? what does that mean?
heres a model of a motherboard: asus p4p800 dualDDR SATA 8X
what does SATA 8X stands for?

hey deadkenny, the someone u are refering to happens to be me... hehehe actually i've never used AMD b4... thats because i had friends using them and all sort of probs accur... so it never cross my mind about AMD... =) i'm still using my old pentium 3 500mhz... lol

see, what happen was i had this 3 frens who bought a pc each... all of them AMD processors, ABIT motherboard... and all of them had the same prob... motherboard crashed, power supply failure resulting in motherboard getting fried.. lol, of yea and the most common thing was they alwiz get this 'blue screen' thingy....

and spyman thanx for the specs.... i would prefer an intel spec :t
is the ati radeon graphic card better than the geforce 4??

[Torlok2002]

an 8mb cache is a cache of high speed memory on the HD that will greatly speed things up.


SATA is a new standard for a HD connection, its much smaller than the PATA (big flat IDE cords). I t also offers performance gains over PATA


8X is the type of AGP slot on it. 8X is currently the best AGP there is. This will support the latest video cards.


SATA and 8X are not directly associated with each other

[oblivion81]

thanx torlok... that serves my knowlegde pretty well....:t

[spyman]

I'm on my 3rd Amd based system and have never had a problem yet, other than a few via chip set probs. on my last system, but they were vias problems not amds and were fixed with a driver update. As far as I know Amd boards are just as stable as any intel board, if your friends had problems with them, they must have configured them wrong or didn't have a proper power supply. Abit is one of the top manufactures for both intel and amd, and many of my friends have used abit/amd combos for years. I'm new to using Abit(former asus fan), but they're my board of choice from now on. I love the softmenu3.
But hey you can't go wrong with intel either, it'll just cost you more. I think asus or abit would be top choices for intel boards as well.

[oblivion81]

hi spyman, hehe i wasn't condeming AMD or ABIt... lol :p
but you could be right in terms of misconfiguration... but i think the problems lies withing the supplier though.... cos most of the shopkeepers doesnt know much ... they only know the common stuff... and thats one of my main reason of trying to gain knowlegde on myself.... :D

[tantone]

That's a fact. If you want to build your own systems, you need to know the information yourself. Asking some 60-watt of a light bulb guy at the shop will get you the minimum wage computer-geek answer (you know...the geek who's closest encounters with a female have been virtual) and perhaps not what it is you're really looking for.

Good luck in your quest for knowledge. These forums are a great place to pick things up. I have to hand it to spyman...one of the few AMD proponents who will actually state more than "AMD rules. Intel sucks" and admit that Intel still reigns the performance market, while also topping the list on prices.

I just finished building a new Intel-based system (P4 3GHz, Asus P4C800E-Deluxe, Radeon 9800 Pro, 1GB Corsair TwinX PC3200) and I've had absolutely NO trouble with it from the second I pressed the power button. However, I did spend a decent amount of $$ on the parts.

Top of the line AMD v top of the line Intel will only save you about $200. So, if you can roll that into your budget, I say go for it.

[spyman]

Intel does suck and AMD does rule!LOL:D :t
Buy whatever you like they both are great, but yes do some research. I researched for about 2 months before I made up my mind on which motherboard/cpu/videocard to buy. I bet I read over 100 reviews before I finally decided, thats the fun of it for me. Just don't go on one persons opinion.

[morpheus kain]

Actually AMD has the performance crown too...... FX-51 anyone? Yes, thank you. Anyway I would definitely suggest the ABIT and the 2500+ built one of those a few weeks ago and it's a rather potent combination!



*edit* Also with a little overclocking and some decent cooling you'll have a 3200+ for the price of a 2500+!!

[oblivion81]

lol ...... :r thanx for advice guys.... and tantone... i bet ur pc rocks... best graphic card... best motherboard... best what else? lol mind the AMD ... lol

*oblivion runs for his life from all AMD's freaks.... *

[Magua]

If money is a factor, which it sounds like it is, you will definately get more bang for your buck with an AMD 2500+ with an Asus or Abit motherboard. For the best advice let us know your budget, any components you might already have (optical drives, hard drives, etc.) and what accessories must be included in your budget (speakers, keyboard, mouse, operating system). Are you definately set on going Intel?

[Bat25]

AMD 2500 with Abit Nf7_S kicks serious *****, because indeed - you can get it to run as an XP3200 at about 1.725 voltage. Not too bad for $90.00 processor. Intel has also come down on prices, and does have the fastest setup. But Value, and bang for the buck go to Abit Nforce2 and the Xp2500

:x

[morpheus kain]

No... I'll say it again... Athlon FX51 OWNZ the #$%^ performance crown!

[tantone]

Ya can't argue with that. Yes, it does.

Comparing apples and oranges. If you look at 32-bit processors only (which removes the FX51), then Intel takes the crown.

[morpheus kain]

Why would you compare "32bit processors only" the FX only runs in 32bit mode on XP because XP is only a 32bit operating system... So in essence ATM it is only a 32bit processor... When the new XP comes out it'll be a 64/32bit processor. So, thank you very much smarty pants, they are both apples at this time!

[Bat25]

Yeah, my bad, I totally forgot the A-64 - it is the fastest ;) But IMO it does not matter if you choose Intel, XP, or A-64, if you run a good vid card you'll be ok. It just doesen't matter at all. As long as you like the setup. Won't be long though befire the Intel EE (extremely Expensive) edition bests it though - but...again...the AMD will be less expensive, and will probably be the better deal.

I have two A-64 mobos due in this week. Rigs will be built by next wednesday.

[Bat25]

Originally posted by morpheus kain
No... I'll say it again... Athlon FX51 OWNZ the #$%^ performance crown!

I said "bang for the buck". Read up.

[morpheus kain]

Originally posted by Bat25
Intel has also come down on prices, and does have the fastest setup.


You said Intel has the fastest setup, and they don't. Duh. The EE's aren't faster than the FX either, and they are insanely expensive. On top of all that CPU does matter, there is no doubt about it go look at some benchmarks bafoon

[scottluebke2003]

Honestly, it doesnt matter which CPU is fastest because the large majority of users dont spend over $200 on a cpu. So the arguement is best when it comes down to midrange cpus, not the top notch CPU's. And when it comes down to it, P4 rocks, AMD XP rocks. P4 will cost you more, AMD XP will be louder. Both cpu's are great and I doubt you will find many people who hated their system, as long as they set it up right and knew how to maintain it. HP owners hate them because the piles are garbage, but the companies that make the components are not. The system is just configured poorly. A properly researched and configured computer will provide you will 24/7 rock solid and high speed performance. I research my system for 3 months before I bought, I will read hundreds of reviews on all the parts. It has given me NO problems and 1 year later, it still runs very fast and does everything great. Piggy backing on someone elses post, "dont take the opinion of just one guy, get tons of advice and you will make a good purchase you will not regret"

[oblivion81]

:x lol .... what a debate.... anyway thanx for all of u guys opinion... it help me alot and it'll definately help me later on in choosing the components i want.... hehehe

i prefer to use pentium bcos i think its much more reliable... am i rite or im just bullsh*ting here ... :r

[spyman]

i prefer to use pentium bcos i think its much more reliable... am i rite or im just bullsh*ting here ... :r [/B][/QUOTE]


No your not right you just don't know much about computers. I think you would be much better off getting someone to build you a computer vs you trying it yourself. Go to your local computer store and give the guy a price range for an intel based machine. Or search the web and gather as much knowledge as you can like the rest of us did and learn about them before you try to build one.

Building your own computer can be very rewarding, but you must have some knowledge about them. I bought my first 2 computers and did many upgrades on them before I dicided I was confident anough to make my own.
Gang some knowledge, computers aren't cheap to fix when you do something wrong. I know lots of guys with horror storys of cracked cores from improper hs placement.
good luck:t

[Bat25]

Originally posted by morpheus kain
You said Intel has the fastest setup, and they don't. Duh. The EE's aren't faster than the FX either, and they are insanely expensive. On top of all that CPU does matter, there is no doubt about it go look at some benchmarks bafoon

Morpheus, Most of us know that the EE is expensive (will be) but I dont figure that will last long - and it will be moderately priced about the same as the A-64 (I Just got 4 more Athlon 64's in my shop - one of which im doing a review on another tech site with the Asus mainboard). Jeez sorry about no realizing the A-64 was faster - after all I did review one myself ;) I just forgot, as the P4 was faster for some time over the XP (in mosts tests not all).

Also im due to get the EE in once production mainstream has started. As to the Bafoon remark _ i'll disregard it this time, and I do read nearly all the reviews, and also add to the reviews a 2 other sites.

[oblivion81]

hehehe... thanx for the advice...
i'm just looking around of what to get... but to fix it... i'll definately leave it to the shop person... or like u say... it's not wise to fix the components myself.

i met one of my cousins today, found out he has a pc shop... and he told me AMD was good and Intel was a dying brand... lol really?:r

[morpheus kain]

AMD is far from dying :-). And I'm sorry for calling you a bafoon that was uncalled for I was just getting a little irked because I'm a little AMD fanboy but I definitely will give Intel credit for what they've done. From PCSTATS.COM When it does finally arrive, Intel's Pentium 4 Extreme Edition will play second fiddle to the Athlon 64 FX.

[omendata]

Intel have thge advantage in the temperature safety stakes.

Ive blown at least two AMD chips because of the heat issue!!!

Expensive!!!

[morpheus kain]

Built many AMD's... Never had one heat problem....

[omendata]

First time was the early durons - didnt know about the heat issue until I came on here!

Second time I was just a fanny and switched my pc without the fan on top - duh!¬

Never happens with an Intel

[oblivion81]

hahaha.... yea yea i heard about the heat issue of the AMD chip...they are quite 'warmer' than intel chips....
so with motherboards for AMD like the FX64 something... ?? meaning AMD chips are going to run at 64 bit eh... hmmmmm interesting!
hey kain, how many fans do u have in that CPU of yours? for ur AMD hot chip. =):r

[Disk11]

Heh, AMD just don't have onchip heat protection. Intel has to come up with a new motherboard standard to cool their 100W+ chips (BTX (http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1876)). And the Opterons have really low heat dispersion from what I hear, so that should carry over to the mainstream lines.

[Bat25]

Originally posted by morpheus kain
AMD is far from dying :-). And I'm sorry for calling you a bafoon that was uncalled for I was just getting a little irked because I'm a little AMD fanboy but I definitely will give Intel credit for what they've done.

That PC stats review was one "pre-review". Im also an AMD fan, but build both on a regular basis for a living. I also use and nforce2. You might try to be more humble in your posts if your knowledge is "really" at the level where your posts indicate it is. I would advise you try not to be-little others as I see you take that tone on these forums - lest I or someone else get's tired of it and decides to humiliate you with tech that you can barely follow. I finished all 3 A-64 systems and I shipped 2 out this morning. 2 were soc 940 and one soc 754. All were fast.

It's not that Intel needs "credit" for what they have done. It's that you need to take heed that a good system is a good system. Fast is fast. When it comes down to symtantics, anyone can go to a tech site a throw quotes up there.There's no sense in getting peeved against Intel or AMD. When you have built 235+ rigs and submitted 12 reviews I'll listen to your scarcasm. Until then, your just a 16 year old that spouts off. Period.

[morpheus kain]

I was right, period. I was mature enough to apologize because I thought I was wrong in calling you a bafoon, but you just proved that you're not only a bafoon, you're also arrogant and petty. I know a fast system when I see one. The credit Intel deserves is for the Netburst architecture because at first they got very little, but low and behold it has scaled very well and is now able to put up some impressive numbers. Also, I wasn't getting peeved at AMD or Intel, I was tired of people not reading the post. It's very simple AMD now has the faster processor, and the EE wasn't able to take that away. Yeah anyone can go to tech sites, that's why they are there, and obviously no one else had read that or they would've known that the AMD was faster. On top of all that, if you take your time, and know what you are doing you won't burn up your processor from overheating. So mister high and mighty, thank you, and shut up.:t

[deadkenny]

Originally posted by omendata
First time was the early durons - didnt know about the heat issue until I came on here!

Second time I was just a fanny and switched my pc without the fan on top - duh!¬

Never happens with an Intel

Intel processors have the temp protection built into the processor. AMD later specified that m/b's supporting AMD processors should have this built-in. So it is possible to fry an AMD processor on an older m/b, this simply isn't an issue any longer with current equipment.

[omendata]

Cmon you two we dont need another P4-gamer flaming match again!

Kiss and makeup

:-@

[Bat25]

Morhpeus~

Official results from Maximum PC - and my friends at Velocity Micro show the Intel EE as faster. It won't do me any good to post it up here, Go get yourself a copy.Even then I still think they are neck and neck, but the EE still beats it marginally ( im talking about the FX51 soc 940 not the socket 754), the FX-51 will also be very expensive, about $800.00 to Intels $900.00. What the Intel has over AMD is that current P4 owners will not have to change mainboards or ram to run it. Athlon owners will have to change everything except optical and HDD's. You will have to run registered ram (hard to get and expensive) with your AMD socket 940.

The quick rundown shows Intel EE beating AMD in UT2003, Jedi Outcast, Q3, InDesign 2.0 Export to PDF, Photoshop (except mac filters), Compressot VS. Fast encoder, while the AMD 64 also won few bench marks in it's own right. I think it's so close that certain hardware sites that are shall we say..."fan's" of Intel, or AMD will claim number one.

My friend and colleague at Velocity Micro (the best commercial PC game box builder going) also tells me that the P4 EE bests the AMD - only slightly....not enough to brag about though. Were talking only a few frames per second difference between the two in nearly all benchmarks, save a few where the architecture of the chips respectively come into play.

Just a little FYI Morpheus, I now have the EE in my shop and am testing it in the 875p Intel mobo this weekend. It won't knock my socks off "Morpheus" because I have built with it in the past, because it's basically a Xeon server chip that I have installed before in networks - only difference is it's been taken off the assembly line to run with the existing P4 mobos - but Im already familiar with the performance somewhat. One of the 754 pin soc A-64's I sold to a 16 year old lan gamer in the CPL here in Dallas. The other two were used in server applications.

Like I said - the two chips. AMD Athlon 64 FX51 and the Intel EE are neck and neck. Many faithfull AMD users like you and me might get a new mainboard, ram, then the AMD processor, but you also need to take heed that the P4 crowd wont have to change a thing, only the processor to run the EE, and by the time both become more popular as we know it (I told you I have been using the EE aka "Xeon" in server installations) for 3 years running, then they will probrbly be priced more like P4 EE=$700.00, and AMD 64FX51=$650.00. This would be in about 6 months to a year. But you WILL have to run an FX51 to think about keeping pace with an Intel EE that runs on an 875p mainboard with regular DDR ram.

Right now you see lot's of AMD loyalists throwing away thier nforce2 motherboards and getting VIA, and Nforce3 mainboards with A-64 chips (not to be confused with the FX51), and...they are going to be very upset when they again...have to buy another mainboard to fit the socket 940 FX51 when it comes down in price in less than a year. That's 3 mainboards in years time, and the specific registered DDR ram that has to go with it while the 875p owner (or 865 PE) can sit back, relax, and not have to worry about changing anything for two to 3 years, except getting a new CPU.

I'll say it again, they are both fast - but we just now understanding how fast - so try not to jump to conclusions over PC stats or anyone else just yet. By the way. I dont burn up processors, AMD or Intel. Like you said, if you build it correctly neither will burn up.

Your apology is accepted, and I likewise apologise If I have offended you there. Personally? I think these chips are really neck and neck, about the same. But i'll know more this weekend about how they "feel" and perform with 3Dmark 2K1, 2K3, Aquamark, SpecView, and some other gaming benchmarks. Myself I am very happy with my nforce2 mainboard for now, and ..I like real time Dolby digital encoding on the fly. I won't be upgrading for a while, probably about a year.

On a nice note. It's good to see someone who is 16-17 deep into the hardware scene as yourself. It means you will be that much better later on. I see you have helped alot of people here also, and that's always nice

[morpheus kain]

*shakes hands and makes up*:t :D

[oblivion81]

hahaha... what a post, bat25! man that was a long one but also a good one.

nice to see that both of you make up... as this forum doesn;'t need any show offs ... :r

[Bat25]

Heh, yeah your right. Lot's of nice members here. Intel 875p finished this afternoon - really fast, and totally stable to boot. I have an order for it already. So it won't be in the shop long. Not going to push it past stock. Stock numbers are amazing, but are only slightly above the FX51 at best. You know now (besides current prices) is a great time for mobos and chipsets, and processors, because it looks like a dead heat, and it may come down to preference of reliability and features, and chipset drivers. All I can say is that after testing with both the FX51 and the EE the Athlon XP is truely a budget chip now. It's the new "duron' per say, because the FX51 and Intel EE are insanely fast with great memory bandwidth, which is fab for gaming or DV editing.