Building a computer, need advice on the best way(s) to partition the HDD

[rummy]

My first try at homebuilding. I've got a 40gig Western Digital drive. Gonna run W98SE. Every part is new, no data to protect. I surf via 56k, play online games (primarily Counter-Strike), do a little MP3 stuff, fax, caller ID, etc. I *might* try adding another OS later (W2K orXP or?). I know about PartitionMagic.
I'd like some pointers on the *best* way to partition-out my drive.
Many thanks!

[smokin1]

There really is no "best"..it comes down to preferences..I prefer to have a small "c" drive..maybe 2 or 2 1/2 gigs..and 2 others..one for programs and the other for..well..whatever. I load all the drivers and what not on c and nothing else. It makes for easy backup of the OS and settings. If I hose it, I can format C and reinstall from the back up cd..no need to reinstall everything.
2c
http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif

[rummy]

So, the partitions are basically *transparent* as far as operating system is concerned? There aren't any special directions as to programs, apps, etc that must be grouped with one another on a specific partition?
Thanks, in advance, for your patience.

[krusty the klown]

Providing there's space, you can install software anywhere you like (even windoze). It doesn't have to be in C:\Program Files\... You can just point it elsewhere by clicking on 'browse' when the installation location screen pops up.

The OS sees the partitions as separate drives and assignes each partition a drive letter. You'll need to set the boot partition as active (in Fdisk or partition magic, whichever you're using).

The largest and most efficient size for a FAT32 drive is 7Gig - above this, the cluster size starts to increase above 4kB (I think it's 4k). If you have a file smaller than the cluster size, then that file occupies that whole cluster and space is wasted on the disk.... however, you may just decide that 40G is loads anyway and you can't be *sed to create 6 partitions!!

[rummy]

Good info, keep it coming, please.

[lai918]

What u guys suggest to do with a 20Gb hard disk partition? Can i just put 10 Gb for each ? How many clusters will i lost if i do that?

[challenger]

I have a western digital 40gig and I just have one 37.3gig partition running FAT32. Is this bad? Should I make multiple partitions?

[Andy_L]

But, the more partitions you have, the more disks you have to keep track of in Win9X. I usually devide a large drive into a managable size operating system and use the rest for data, that way you can format the c: drive and still have your drivers, cab files, etc on your d: drive.

[wyvrn]

With today's type of files, having a cluster size of more than 4KB is not going to hurt you. Most files are say 3-5 MB, so wasting 3KB of that is no big deal. Just make one (possibly two) partitions and use folders. That is what they were intended for http://www.sysopt.com/forum/wink.gif

[araaraara]

At least use 4kb clusters for the partition with windows. It has so many small files.

[alondra]

how many partitions is a mater of choice, I make no recomendations here, BUT when you start puting things in them, make a list for each. keep track of what you put where, many proggys try to just go to "C" you have a choice. I have an 8 in 4 sections and they are a mess, I didn't think of organizing them. I have simular proggys in 2 or 3 sections. http://www.sysopt.com/forum/frown.gif and cant figure out how to move them. just my opinion for what it is worth http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif

[jman01pa]

I agree with wyvrn. I prefer just a single partition. For myself it is easier to manage. I do run two hard drives though. One for OS and Programs and the other for Data, downloads, MP3's etc.... Dividing the drive into two parts would accomplish the same

My experience with people that have multiple partions reveals a full primary partion and empty secondary partitons. Of course this would be differnt with an experienced user.

Just my two cents

J http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif

[acqbonehead]

I agree with smoki1. That is to say I to would go with 3 partitions. One for the OS and drivers, one for all programs and the last for whatever. I also use the program partition for downloads of any freeware, shareware or trials. This way I know where everthing is any the boot partition is clean. I also believe it is a question of choice.

[AuraEdge]

Theres basically 3 advantages that I can think of a partition has over a folder
1 -> If something goes arway in windows, you can backup stuff on other partitions, and format just C:, preserving any data files you have.
2 -> It defrags seperately (if you have 2 folders in C, you have to defrag the whole drive at once)
3 -> You can install another OS on it.

Otherwise you can use seperate folders just as seperators to keep things neat, instead of having a million and one partitions.
I ALWAYS suggest at least 2 partitions, just for the first reason. Me, I have 8 Partitions, so maybe I don't practice what I preach. All I'm saying is if you dont partition enough, it wont drastically reduce what you can do, or how neat your data is.

When I install harddrives for people and ask them how they want it partitioned, they usually have C: for just about everything, and D: for Music (In college everyones a Musicmonger). Then I tell them a GB is about 250 songs and give me a value that they are pretty sure they will never go over for music, at least in the foreseeable future. (Some its 2GB, some its 5, some as much as 10, 15 or 20..I let them say it so they have it just how they want it). Then I just make the rest C: so they dont get too confused.
Even though its nice to keep your music on a seperate drive, the real purpose behind me doing this is because if I ever need to format thier machines, its easy to save key files.

Me personally, my partitions are as follows


Disk1 & Disk2 (RAID0)

C: WinMESys (Primary) (WinME and all non-game apps installed on it)
D: Win2KSys (Logical) (Win2K and all non-game apps installed on it
E: Games (Logical)
F: Music (Logical)
G: Files (Logical) (I keep original EXE's of all files I download, so I have easy access to any drivers, game demos or anything like that.
H: Cache (Logical) (Relatively small partition with IE Temp files, Download Temp files, RC5, and other files that get written and rewritten all the time. Keeps the fragmentation out of my main drives)

Disk3

I: Movies (Logical)
J: Backup (Logical) (Backup of important files, so even Disk 1 or 2 fail, or both my Windows **** out, I have a fallback and can get my old emails, ICQ list, start menu, etc., back.

See how complicated that was? I started with just a C: for everything and a D: for music, just like the people I install harddrives for, and a few reformats, 2 Hard Drives, and many repartitioning through Partition magic later, 8 partitions formed.

Partitions are completely transparent. DOS, Windows, everything, will treat it as another physical drive. (If you took a 20 and made a 5GB and a 15GB Partition, It would be just like if you had a 5GB Drive and a 15GB drive).

Lost space from clusters and such is a non issue these days of multi-GB harddrives. Total storage space in Windows is about 92% of the drives on the 6 way partitioned drive, and about 93% of the 2 way partitioned drive. I think good planning is the key to partitioning well and not running out of space on each partition, not partitions that will squeeze every last cluster-sector out.

[rummy]

Wow, I appreciate the time everyone has taken to help me out, especially AuraEdge, I can now see and understand the advantages of both single and multiple partition set-ups. I think I will aquire PartitionMagic and put it to use.

Maybe folks partition their HDD kinda like they organize other items in their lives? LOL http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif

I'm still interested, so, don't hesitate to post more advice.

Thanks, again..
...Doug

[doebuns]

I've got 2 hard drives, a 30 and a 20, with 4 OS's. ME and 2K on one drive with 2 more partitions for archive and video work. 98SE and Linux on the other drive with a couple of extra partitions for data and archive.
Yes! I know I'm nuts and if I lose a drive I can still play. Generally, I do try to keep partitions under 8 Gig for the smaller cluster sizes and separation of data. Makes defragging, scandisk, or virus checking a particular OS a lot quicker also.

[araaraara]

Breakl it into 5 8gig partitions. This will give you a cluster size of 4kb, which should reduce wasted space.

[wyvrn]

Theres basically 3 advantages that I can think of a partition has over a folder
1 -> If something goes arway in windows, you can backup stuff on other partitions, and format just C:, preserving any data files you have.
2 -> It defrags seperately (if you have 2 folders in C, you have to defrag the whole drive at once)
3 -> You can install another OS on it.

1) deltree windows works faster. I believe someone also posted before a way to completely clean a windows install without formatting. I think you could even setup most of it as a batch file.

2) Yep. Of course you only get the speed advantages of defrag on that one partition, so I am not sure what the advantage of this method is. If you wanted to defrag everything, then it takes less time for 1 large drive than 2 or more smaller ones, and does not require user intervention during the defrag process. It is a walkaway job (IE when you are sleeping, and can be scheduled.)

3) I can install 2 OS's on one partition. But yes I can see where 2 parts would be better/neccessary, especially if a flavor of Linux is installed.

Your advantages are merely another way to do things.

[This message has been edited by wyvrn (edited 04-26-2001).]

[mousepotato]

...hummm...3 WD HD's here....one 30g ATA100,
one 20g ATA66 & one 10g ATA66...the 30gig is now my OS drive due to benchmark speed...the 10 gig is a mirror of the 30...{back up (LOL)..}....the 20g is music and install downloads/setup programs...I back up zip files on CD so I can re-unzipp anywhere I choose...I use Win ME so I have restore function along with all the back-up files.
...I defrag almost every night so it only takes 15-20 minutes to run all 3 drives, this 'putter runs all but about 50 hours a week...( I have to work sometimes...lol)
...all of them are single partitions because I like to have more than one physical drive to move things to in case I ever have a question of failure...lately I've been thinking of formating this 30 gig and load a bare ME O/S and just use the tweeks & programs off the 10 to see if it'll benchmark
better...if it dosen't I can allways mirror the 10 back to the 30 again...this setup allows me to play around quite a bit so it works for me...
,...back to the question...I'd probaly get a small drive for just the OS & whether you partition the 40g or now won't matter...put a workable OS on the smaller drive and PLAY!!...find out what YOU like to do...you'll have the orignal OS there whenever you want it...going to have to look into that cluster size thing...although I like haveing 3,400 songs to choose from in one place...lol...maybe I'll make a shortcut folder...hummmmmmmm....*IDEA*....maybe...lol

[rummy]

Would I see any decrease in performance of, say, gameplay, with the OS and the game being on separate HDD's? Any other negatives? I'm pretty certain you aren't using RAID, am I right MousePotato? Just Master/Slave/Slave?
Knowledge is good, learning is fun!
(pretty corny, huh?) http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif

[wyvrn]

I'm not aware that you can install say 2K and 98 on the same Partition.

I have done it. I have also done it with WinNT and Win2k. Although I recommend 2 parts for any dual boot.

With the defragging thing, you can put highly fragmented stuff in one small partition and just defrag that alot. If you put it in a folder, you need to defrag that entire partition.

Ok yes this is true, but do people really sit around and watch the pretty colors during defrag. I don't mean to belabor (sp?) the pt., but just do it when you aren't there.

If you renamed C:\windows and then reinstall, I think it will treat it as a new install. Format is still by far the cleanest way to start over.

So true. However some people may be reformatting when they actually need to just reinstall a driver or troubleshoot a bit. Just MO, not picking on you.

Would I see any decrease in performance of, say, gameplay, with the OS and the game being on separate HDD's?

Well I am guessing you are keeping the swap files on the main part., so as long as the two drives are on different IDE controllers, you might see a performance increase as you can read both at the same time.

[This message has been edited by wyvrn (edited 04-26-2001).]

[mousepotato]

...well...right now it's set like this:
30gig master IDE1 on ATA100 promise card,
20gig master IDE2 on promise card,
10gig slave IDE2 on promise card
CDRW master IDE1 on AV61 mobo
CD rom slave on IDE1 on AV61 mobo

on the promise card IDE1 is realy 5 in BIOS ect....the mobo supports only ATA66...

I have a bit of playing around to do to see what works the best...still have another HD & a 100meg NEC zip drive to add if I want...
...just working on what seems the best to me first...lol

[AuraEdge]

My setup is similar, except my CD drive and CDRW drive are swapped. I wanted the CDRW on its own channel, to decrease chance of underruns.

45GB 7200RPM ATA/100 Master on IDE3 (IDE1 on ATA-100 RAID channel)
45GB 7200RPM ATA/100 Master on IDE4 (IDE2 on ATA-100 RAID channel)
DVD-ROM Master on IDE1
20GB 7200RPM ATA/66 Slave on IDE1
CD-RW Master on IDE 2.

You should move the CD Rom and CDRW on seperate channels, so that if you do a CD to CD copy, it can read both medias simultaneously, to limit underruns.

Wyvrn - You can install both on the same Partition? Thats news to me...Cool. Since you say it's still unrecommended, I wont ask you how to do it, and just continue to do it the recommended way. http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif

People shouldnt watch the pretty colors when they defrag (though it is kinda intrancing the first couple times people see it). However when someone asks me, whys my computer running so much slower than when I first got it? And I tell them to defrag C:, they dont expect to be waiting there 4 hours.

I defrag out everything at once personally, so it doesnt make a difference to me.

I understand inspecting every possibility of whats wrong before you go for the Format C:\, but there are always some instances where the easiest fix is a backup and Format C: and reinstall. Some problems just can't be fixed, or just havent been encountered before and theres no 'fix' for it. The Format C:\ command is no stranger to any seasoned computer user.

And assuming identical drives, performance with games on a different drive on different IDE cahnnels will always be greater, because as wyvrn said, both can be read at once, but the Harddrive usually isnt a game bottleneck. Levels may load faster, and things like that, but dont expect more FPS.

[AuraEdge]

I'm not aware that you can install say 2K and 98 on the same Partition.

With the defragging thing, you can put highly fragmented stuff in one small partition and just defrag that alot. If you put it in a folder, you need to defrag that entire partition.

And if say C: is highly fragmented, and thats 2GB and D: isnt, and thats 18GB, you dont need to defrag all 20GB for have a relatively defragged system.

If you renamed C:\windows and then reinstall, I think it will treat it as a new install. Format is still by far the cleanest way to start over.

[krusty the klown]

AuraEdge - running 2K and W98 on the same partition here @ work. Install 98, install 2K and choose the 'do not replace your current OS' (or similar - not sure of the exact wording).

Obviously, you have to run FAT 32 and cannot change to NTFS. Also, if you do choose this route, it can get messy!! I just went into it without thinking ahead... where does Win98 put installed programs by default.... and where does Win2K put installed program files by default.... Yep, you guessed it - comedy program failures when you remove something from one OS that's installed on the other http://www.sysopt.com/forum/redface.gif Heck, it's how we learn http://www.sysopt.com/forum/smile.gif