Drive Image 4.0 experts...are you out there?

[jim.t]

Got a question about these instructions. It says to load HIMEM.SYS into CONFIG.SYS and run PQPACKET.EXE so images can be created on CD-r or CD-rw. Is this necessary? Can't I just create a non-packet type data cd, or is this for spanning purposes? I've used my writer alot, but have avoided using packet processing. I'll probably bug y'all to death before this is over. LOL.

[jim.t]

As I'm finding out, you can't take a drive image and write it down on the same drive...you must either write it to a different partition(which I haven't setup yet) or write it to cd-rw, which I'm having problems with the config.sys entry. Any enlightenment would be great.

[jim.t]

Awww, c'mon. Someone must know.

[Harold7]

I just burned a partition image to CD-RW with PM 4.0 and no you don't have to do anything special. According to the manual, on Page 13 it says "If you run Drive Image from the main installation directory or from the rescue disks PQPACKET will run automatically." Just make sure you use a blank, unformatted CD-RW disk for any image files and you shouldn't have any problems. Go to Start/Run type in sysedit and check your Configsys file to see waht's there. Mine using Win 98SE is empty and I have no problems using CD-RW with DI... http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

[jim.t]

did it run along time and use alot of cd's? I've only got about 3.5gb to backup. I'm glad you posted. I'm been to the Powerquest site and read a few ticked off PQDI owners posts, and was about to just give it up 'til they get these quirks worked out and you posted. Man, I hope it's that easy when I do it tonight. I've backed up everything adn installed the software last night, so I'm ready to go.

[Harold7]

If I use the Highly Compressed option, I can usually get about 680 mb on one CR-RW disk (I use Sony disks).

It appears that using this packet writing technique lets you use almost all of the space on a CD-RW instead of the 650 mb limit that seems to be the case otherwise.

When you go through the process of writing the image file direct to the CD-RW, DI will give you a screen showing approximately how many CDs you will need.

I say approximately because the image I burned yesterday said I would need two disks, but loaded on just one CD-RW as a 585 mb file.

If nothing else works, you can create the highly compressed partition image on a separate partition of your HD and then burn that image as a data cd... presumimg you can fit all of it on one CD-RW.

Then, as long as you can see your CD drive(s) when you run DI, you can restore from CD-RW that way.

Make sure you test your DI boot disks to ensure that you can access your CD drive(s)in an emergency... if you can't, use a Windows boot disk to boot to a DOS prompt with CD Rom support and at the A:\ prompt put in DI Disk #2, type in pqdi, Enter and you can access your CD-Rom drive that way after DI loads.

One problem I've always had with DI is that you have to keep the size of your boot partition to 2048 mb or less or when you try to restore an image into a partition larger than 2048 mb you get a message saying you have exceeded the 1024 cylinder limit and the partition will not be bootable.
I found out the hard way that this is true... I tried restoring an image file into a 5 gb partition and anded up with a system which would not boot because the partition table had been messed up.

Unluckily, I had to reformat the HD to repair the partition table, repartitioned with Partition Magic, resized C drive to 2048 mb and restored the boot partition image file from a CD-RW into the new partition and it worked.
Hope this helps. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

[jim.t]

Thanks Harold7, just got done with my first backup. Whewwww. Glad that's over. PQ need s to update their manuals to the new releases..got lost a couple of times. There oughta be an easier way to input your file names/new image/destination, but, hey, it worked. Haven't tried to restore yet...that's phase II. Thanks for the info....will keep it handy.



[This message has been edited by jim.t (edited 02-14-2001).]

[jim.t]

Harold...gotta question about you unlucky effort to restore into 5gb. I guess I missed the part where you have to keep the size of your boot partition to 2048mb or you'll shred the partition table. Sounds like a very serious position to be put in without a "warning" from the software.

[Harold7]

jim.t
Sorry I wasn't more specific, you do get an error/warning message if you try to restore an image file into a partition that is larger than 2048 mb.

See page 60 of the instruction manual for a brief explanation under "Displaying Drive Information".

The warning message only has relevence for your bootable partition... you can restore image files into a partition larger than 2048 mb with no problem as long as it is a logical partition and not your boot partition.

You'll still get the warning message saying you're going past the 1024 cylinder limit and the partition may not be bootable, but it means nothing for logical partitions and you can safely ignore it.

I exchanged many messages with PowerQuest tech support when using earlier versions of Drive Image before getting the whole story and as far as I can tell you should keep your boot partition size to 2048 mb or less when using Drive Image if your OS requires the boot code to be within the first 2 gb on your HD.

Just remember that if you make any hardware or made software changes on a partition you've imaged, you'll have to burn a new image or really have a mess on your hands.

Hope this info helps, Drive Image is a great program, but the documentation leaves alot to be desired. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

[jim.t]

Ok, one more time http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif. I have a 40gb HD that's not partitioned. No problem, if I don't use Drive Image. If I partition off this 40gb, the primary drive(c http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif can't be over 2gb, but the others can be as large as you want, as long as they are NOT bootable partitions for other OS's. Is that about right, or am I all wet??

[Harold7]

You're absoluely right, as long as the OS you're using (such as Windows) requires that the boot info must be within the 2048 limit, the size of non-boot (logical) partitions is whatever you want them to be, only the boot partition has to be 2048 mb or less and only if you are going to use Drive Image.

If you have multiple OSs that you boot to and want to create images of, if that OS has the same boot requirements as Windows to be on the first 2 gb on the partition, if you wish to use DI with that partition, you'll have to keep the size of the boot partition of that OS to 2048 mb or less also.

These limits only apply to partitions that you're going to use with DI, if you aren't using DI on a partition it can be whatever size you wish. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

[jim.t]

Ok Harold, thanks. Appreciate the lesson.

[Dave_H]

I have personally restored images of my primary active partition larger than 2GB and it works fine. (I'm using DI 3.0).
My system is Win-98 using FAT32 and my BIOS supports large hard drives, so the 1024'th cylinder is at the 8GB point, not 2GB, on my system.
Dave

Edit- I do get a warning that the system may not be bootable, but I ignore it and it restores fine. As mentioned, I think the warning is givin because some systems have that limitation, usually because of the type of format (FAT16). I have also restored images onto larger partitions, though never tried on larger than 8GB. I'm aware that some files such as "io.sys" are location specific and are required to be in a certain place on the drive for the system to boot, but thats one of the differences between an image and a backup. An image will exactly copy the hard drive sector by sector, the files end up in the same location.
-edit

[This message has been edited by Dave_H (edited 02-15-2001).]

[jim.t]

Well Dave, that makes a huge difference. I'm running WinME/128mb/p3-866, so I guess I fit into that 8gb framework too. I should know all this. I was about to chunk the whole partitioning idea for now, because my machine came with 3.0gb pre-loaded. Be a nightmare trying to split all that **** up.

[daverme]

jim.t, harold, dave ... I'm a DI user but have always used the "cloning" feature. I know you can create an "image file", which is NOT the same as a clone. Maybe it should be obvious but, to my feable brain it is not. Which type of backup are you guys talking about ??? Thx, Dave.

[Harold7]

Daverme
I suspect we're talking about the same thing... an image file made using the Create function is an exact duplicate of everything on the partition, you decide whether or not you want to compress the image file to save space.. a clone in other words.

You can also do disk to disk copies, is that what you mean by a clone?

Dave_H
I haven't used a partition larger than 2gb for my boot drive since I started using DI 2.0, so you may be right. I recall trying to use 5 gb partitions on my WD20.5 gig HD using DI 3.02 and still had the problem with my boot partition being screwed up until I resized to 2 gb... haven't bothered with using a larger partition size since since upgrading to DI 4.0, so you may be right.

I have an SD-11 mobo and my BIOS also supports a large HD, so it should work, but since I basically limit my boot partition to Win98 and a few other programs, I don't really need anything larger... maybe if jim.t ever restores an image file into a partition larger than 2 gb, he'll let us know how it turned out using DI 4.0 http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

I find that by keeping my boot partition at 2 gb, I can create image files that will fit on a CD-RW... the other partitions with data and programs I store in a separate partition that I can access without regard to image file size since I'm not going to put them on CD-RW, only my OS partition is saved to an external, safe location. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

[phecky]

This has been an interesting post for me to follow since I just purchased DI 4.0 for backup solution. Although a bit confusing for a non-tech like me, the manual does make mention of this 2gig limitation and it's marked with a pointer when creating and restoring. But I have to agree with Dave_H if a disk is copyed sector by sector than its image should be restored in the correct order without a problem regardless of partition size. After reading the page 60-61 of the manual for the 5th time it seems to me that this 2gig location is noted as a concern primarly for those using multiple OS's. If an OS is restored below the 2 gig area than it would not work UNLESS the user hides the former active 2gig area (partition) and makes active the new one.

[daverme]

OK, let me try my hand at muddying the waters. For backups, DI offers two functions "Create Image" and "Disk to Disk". The "Create Image" function creates a FILE that contains an image of the partition; that file goes into the file system just like any other file. Now, at one time (and I believe it is still true for FAT and FAT32), there was a limit to how big a FILE could be - 2 Gig. So, if you run from the Rescue Disks (under DOS) of have a FAT or FAT32 file system, will you not be limited to 2 Gig by the file system?

Now, the "Disk to Disk" function creates a sector by sector "clone" of the partition being backed up. I can tell you from pesronal experience that the Disk to Disk function works fine with drives up to 20.5 Gig and partitions up to 12 Gig, those being the largest I have tried so far.

As far is booting is concerned, I have never tried "cloning" a bootable partition other than the first on on the drive, and that always works. I seem to be able to put data partitions where ever I want.

[daverme]

Thanks, Harold. Yes, the disk to disk function is what I mean by a clone.

There was a time when the largest a FILE could be was 2048 MB. Is that still true? If so then that will obviously have an impact on image files.

[jim.t]

Ok Harold7, here are your boot-boundaries:

DOS 6.22...........2gb
WinNT..............4gb
OS/2...............4gb
Win95..............8gb
Linux..............8gb
Win95/98/ME/2000...>8gb

But, it's not recommended to have an OS in greater than an 8gb partition.

[This message has been edited by jim.t (edited 02-16-2001).]