Carnivore - First release of FOIA Docs

[socalgal]

http://www.epic.org/privacy/carnivore/foia_documents.html

Some background:

http://www.epic.org/privacy/carnivore/
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1005-202-2917414.html

[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-04-2000).]

[jad1097]

I just love how the source code looks.

[socalgal]

Quite revealing, isn't it...

[howste]

I wrote some code that looked just like that once. I think maybe they've been digging in my trash...

Steve

[Dave_H]

You think the person with the black pen was a slob or just in a hurry?
Dave

[socalgal]

"Carnivore Details Emerge" ...

Newly declassified documents obtained by Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC) under the Freedom of Information Act reveal that Carnivore can monitor all of a target user's Internet traffic, and, in conjunction with other FBI tools, can reconstruct web pages exactly as a surveillance target saw them while surfing the web.

Full story:

Security Focus (http://www.securityfocus.com/news/097)

Slashdot (http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=00/10/04/1826200)



[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-10-2000).]

[socalgal]

I'll bet the secret ancestor was named "Herbivore" ...

[socalgal]

"Government error exposes Carnivore investigators; ACLU blasts team for close ties to administration"

Full Story (http://www.computerworld.com/cwi/story/0,1199,NAV47_STO51991,00.html)

[socalgal]

http://stopcarnivore.org/

There are currently only two ISPs that are Carnivore-free - according to this site.

My ISP - Earthlink - is still one of them. I repeat my kudos to ELN.

http://stopcarnivore.org/carnfreeisps.htm

[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-19-2000).]

[SoopaStar]

**** this is some scary stuff. you know that @home is probably one of the most watched networks. **** http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif time for a new ISP. So, does an ISP have to agree to let their packets be sniffed or however it is they do that?
Paul

[CMonster]

-psssss..hehe..haha... and you think this is news? Believe me, when anything becomes available via FOIA the powers-that-be have already moved up to the next level.

Just take a look at the Cray supercomputer site and see what kind of systems are commercially available - With power like this available teamed up with high bandwidth internet connectivity a government could impliment a worldwide monitoring and economic system in which no one could buy or sell much of anything without being a part of it. -no wait I'm confusing reality with Bible prophecy......

[socalgal]

Uhh... No kidding, CMonster http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif

But, with *some* info now in the "news" i.e., publicly available, maybe people will get an inkling - even a small one - of what our government is up to and capable of, although I do believe most of us will never know how much.

The more info that can be broadcast, the better likelihood of more ppl becoming aware.


Edit: Just noticed this on the BID site:

http://www.networkice.com/html/altivore.html



[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-20-2000).]

[jad1097]

No joke.


Our town has video cameras set up at just about every stop light, at least 20 that I know of, which is almost all of them. Not to mention the ones in the low income housing projects. WHY?


LMK what you think of this (http://cryptome.org/dark-spy.htm) .

[socalgal]

Hi jad, funny... I was sent the links to that article yesterday. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

This is some fascinating technology! Their core mission was and is a good one, IMO.

I feel less uncomfortable with something like Actis, as compared to Echie or Carnivore, because it's a privately run business (afaik) and being utilized in companies and corporations, perhaps even governmental entities.

But and as such, their employees MUST be notified that tracking software is in place and being used - that's the law, at least here in CA. Businesses, especially those such as Boeing, for example, have every right and, I would say duty, to protect themselves and our country's interests against conspiracies.

Most confidentiality breaches, criminal activities and mayhem against a company/corporation and/or their systems occur from the inside, i.e., disgruntled employees, sell-outs, etc., and I have no problem with their misuse and abuse being dealt with and their sources tracked.

The biggest contention I have with the agencies such as Echie and Carnivore is that it subjects me as a private citizen, in my own home, to unfair and illegal search and seizure, whether by it's mass potential for abuse and error, whether by design or not.

If I am a law-abiding citizen, then this is a breach to enjoy my Constitutional freedoms and rights as a citizen. That is what gets my shackles up!

[This message has been edited by socalgal (edited 10-24-2000).]

[socalgal]

More schtuff


Carnivore review: Experts examining program are government insiders (http://members.cotse.com/cgi-bin/FrameIt.cgi?url=http://www.msnbc.com/news/472692.asp?0nm=-12M) 05 Oct 2000

[socalgal]

Time for some updates:

http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1005-200-3731884.html

http://news.excite.com/news/zd/001117/19/carnivore-raises-new

http://news.excite.com/news/ap/001118/01/tech-carnivore

http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2655658,00.html

http://cryptome.org/carnivore-all.htm

http://cryptome.org/carnivore-jp.htm

[GroundZero3]

im kind of curious..... what happen to the right to privacy?? do they really have the right to set a program up like this and watch every single **** thing we do? it kind of makes me mad when i was reading the stories. even know im still 17 and i don't have any real rights till im 18 i really don't like the idea of them knowing everything i do online. Its basically having them coming up to your doctor and asking all these personal questions.sigh

JaYsin

[Richard_Cranium72]

Criminals - who have a peculiar habit of inputting all their deeds into PCs and handheld computers - often use "software to erase" such incriminating information. Modern techniques, however, such as the molecular analysis of a hard disc, can reveal much of what was "deleted".
<<--I guess this means that the "wipe" programs don't really work ?

And, let me throw the switch on the evil ones who aid in the manufacture of these perverted sites->>
"snuff", or murder, videos "

At work we had a sick azz who liked "Snuff" Movies, we nicknamed him "Fagner"

[socalgal]

Justice Department Study Says FBI Surveillance Tool Basically Sound (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20001122/wr/tech_carnivore_dc_1.html)


Critics Slam 'Whitewash' of FBI Email-Tracking Tool (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20001122/ts/tech_carnivore_dc_1.html)

This isn't good news. http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/frown.gif

[socalgal]

If anyone is interested, you can download and read the

Draft Report: Independent Technical Review of the Carnivore System from IIT Research Institute (IITRI) (http://www.usdoj.gov/jmd/publications/carniv_entry.htm)

It's in .pdf format (Acrobat - Reader).

[TechJumper]

CARNIVORE- HOW IT WORKS!!

i found this wonderful resource from another message board (don't worry, it sucks http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif) this guy put together a full report on all of carnivore- its history (omnivore, EtherPeek) as well as a concise description of how carnivore operates- kinda creepy to think that the FBI could be reading my email...


the link

http://www.howstuffworks.com/carnivore.htm

Have fun-

Mike

[Chief]

This last post is sensible. I'm a retired
Sheriff, it would bother me quite a lot
to think that the FBI was not operating
within the law.

[socalgal]

Thanks for the contribution, Mike! http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif

[TechJumper]

Thanks Socal http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/wink.gif

Cheif-

How very interesting to meet a retired sherrif! What town did you serve in?

--I agree, it is very plausible (especially these days) to assume that the FBI is up to no good. For when an agent can look at your email with no constraints- who decides who is a criminal suspect and who is innocent?


Mike

[Chief]

I retired as sheriff of Pope county in so
Illinois. Retired as Chief radioman out of
Navy before that. Folks are real guillable,
and always look for somebody to blame, like
the FBI for there use of this sniffing
program. My experience with law enforcement
has been that I would have gone to jail if
I had been doing something like what the
FBI is accused of doing. I worked in
law enforcement many years and only saw a
FBI agent maybe three times, and those were
only visits to the sheriffs office to say
that a new agent had moved into area. I had
so many people watching every move I made
that I could not do what we are accusing the
FBI of doing. I know a bunch of Judges, and
they wouldnt let the use of wire tapping-
sniffing programs without probable cause
being established. So what you see reported
on this subject has to be taken with a grain
of salt, because the reporting is very
biased.

[Stu Kopelman]

Privacy is an issue even as early as the 1960s. Technology, at least even secretly, said that if you weren't sure whether "... you were being bugged, you'd better get out of the building; if you really weren't sure, you'd better change your clothes". The implications of that, and what we have available that is not publisized, is staggering. Carnivore is only the tip of the iceberg!

Stu

[Karloff4568]

In speaking of the Law and the FBI, it seems that many government agencies seem to change the Law as the situation dictates. Or it may just seem that way to the general public. Most of the time it appears that they will go ahead and do something that totally violates everyones constitutional rights, knowing (or should know) that its going to blow up in their face or result in a law suit. Even if a court finds them in the wrong, how do they get punished? I can't believe they won't continue to monitor even if it is against the Law. I don't trust them.

[Chief]

Regarding the last post. A lot of people have
bad impressions on Law enforcement. I Know
that I and all the law enforcement around me
were upholders of the law, or they would have
had me to deal with. I know a lot of Sheriffs
in this state, I've watched them closely and
they upheld the laws of our land. I know that
once in awhile you will find a bad one and
I believe that is what gives the bad impressions, also seeing our politicians
act the way they do could make people think
bad. Before my law enforcement was 20 years in the US Navy Protecting the constitution.
There's just no way as law enforcement I would
do anything that would change what I had
spent 20 years of my live doing. Finally
I was not alone, a lot of people my age did
similar things to get this far in life.
Federal law enforcement Officers had similar
attitudes and experiences, and I know
that all of us worked under established rules
and laws. That sniffing tool is good as a
tool, the same as any other enforcement tool
and I have no doubt that it is used properly.

[socalgal]

Recent news:

DCS1000 = Carnivore (http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2684186,00.html)


More on Carnivore (http://www.computerworld.com/resources/carnivore/) .

[RayH]

I've never believed that there is privacy (as we liked to have it) on a system that is supposed to network every computer in the world.

To skirt laws, intelligence gathering agencies quite often use other agencies to gather information that is illegal for the first agency to gather. That is, the CIA may ask the British to gather some information and vice versa.

The best way of sending information is using the computer of someone you don't like! http://sysopt.earthweb.com/forum/smile.gif