AndreRIO
04-30-2002, 06:19 AM
how far will the p3 go 1.5, 2.0ghz? comments?:)
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Jimstep
04-30-2002, 08:10 AM
Are you talking about overclocking potential, or the highest speed that is marketed?
NDD
04-30-2002, 07:46 PM
PentiumIII Coppermine "ends" somewhere near 1.2GHz (remember the 1.13GHz ?! ;) ).
PentiumIII Tualatin can go up to ~1.7GHz.
That's for o/cing :)
As for possible marketing plans : Intel will discontinue PentiumIII Tualatin production probably very soon, maybe even the existing 1.4GHz PIII-S will be the last of PIII family.
PentiumIII Tualatin can go up to ~1.7GHz.
That's for o/cing :)
As for possible marketing plans : Intel will discontinue PentiumIII Tualatin production probably very soon, maybe even the existing 1.4GHz PIII-S will be the last of PIII family.
suprsheep2
04-30-2002, 11:54 PM
How does the P3 tualatin 1.4 compare to the other processors (P4 and athlon xp)?
AndreRIO
05-01-2002, 02:40 AM
suprsheep2, the p3 1.4 is almost as fast as a p4 2.0. Pretty **** fast!
ND, intel will discontinue the p3? why?
ND, intel will discontinue the p3? why?
Slipknot
05-01-2002, 05:05 PM
AndreRIOT, the P3 is indeed a fast chip at 1.4Ghz and up, but it is still running on older chipsets. Intel just like any other company, wants to push the consumer to it's newer products, not older technology. It is always interesting seeing the end of a product though. Do you guys remember how Intel pushed the original pentium MMX up to 300Mhz for laptops. The K6-2 was run past it's prime too, even though amd added a couple new features to the chip like full speed cache. And now the tualatin chips from intel.
Here are some of the reasons I've seen in the past as to why a manufacture continues an older product
--Experimenting with the manufacturing process with a proven core. Example : moving from .18 to .13 micron technology
--CPUs for the mobile market
--CPUs for the embedded market
There are many others, but these seem to be the biggest
Here are some of the reasons I've seen in the past as to why a manufacture continues an older product
--Experimenting with the manufacturing process with a proven core. Example : moving from .18 to .13 micron technology
--CPUs for the mobile market
--CPUs for the embedded market
There are many others, but these seem to be the biggest
suprsheep2
05-01-2002, 08:20 PM
I'm still convinced that the P3 would be faster than any P4 at the same rated speed, Therefore I think that the P4 is a load of ****. I think I'll just go with the 1.4 tualatin.
dawgtuff
05-03-2002, 04:31 PM
Supersheep2- Most are. P3's have a dual pipeline. P-4's are single piped ( info compliments of $1500P4 Gamer).
cheapster
05-04-2002, 08:49 PM
It is always interesting seeing the end of a product though.
It sure is. I sometimes think that the manufacturers are just trying to lure the cheapskates like me into buying the newly featured old technology like the Tualatin Celerons with the 256K cache that are cheap yet provide a pretty good performance boost over the existing celerons.. Of course I will also need to buy the latest version of my existing motherboard to support the newer Tualatin processor and my gains while real would probably not be that great. But boy those 1 gig Tualitin Celerons sure are cheap and are supposed to all run 1.33 gig at least. Temptations, temptations.:confused:
Chuck
It sure is. I sometimes think that the manufacturers are just trying to lure the cheapskates like me into buying the newly featured old technology like the Tualatin Celerons with the 256K cache that are cheap yet provide a pretty good performance boost over the existing celerons.. Of course I will also need to buy the latest version of my existing motherboard to support the newer Tualatin processor and my gains while real would probably not be that great. But boy those 1 gig Tualitin Celerons sure are cheap and are supposed to all run 1.33 gig at least. Temptations, temptations.:confused:
Chuck
-tetsujin-
05-04-2002, 10:41 PM
Well the Pentium 4 as we know it is just a stripped down piece of junk as opposed to what the project outset was when they began development. It's no small wonder that the thing is a piece of ****. P3's beat its *** but they also have reached their frequency peak. That old Pentium Pro core just can't keep adding speed the way it has. Intel needs to find a new cow to milk and it ain't the P4.
kazuza
05-04-2002, 11:37 PM
Nonsense...
PIII forever!
It will be my AVATAR very soon ;)
No stealling, please!
PIII forever!
It will be my AVATAR very soon ;)
No stealling, please!
Slipknot
05-04-2002, 11:47 PM
I think you guys have forgotten the 2 ways to build a CPU
BRUTE FORCE
EFFICIENCY
We all know the Athlon and P3 are very effecient chips. The P4 is a screaming giant cable of very high speeds. Honestly, it doesn't matter which way you plan to go, as long as the end result is a fast core. No matter how you say it, the P4 is still one hell of a chip. Don't forget that the P4 was also originally matched up with rambus as it's soul mate. The P4 rambus platform can be a monster.
Look at these benchmarks and you will see what I mean. The future is still very bright for the P4 architechture.
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q1/020225/p42666-08.html
Here are 3 Finally thoughts.
--Pentium4 on 533Mhz bus with Dual Channel Ram ROCKS
--I'm not a Intel lover, I just like looking at the good and bad in a product, not just the bad. Everyone knows that when the original P4 at 1.3, 1.4 and 1.5GHz came out, it wasn't very fast, but this is the case with most chip launches. When the Pentium Pro arrived on the scene, everyone said it wasn't that much faster then the orignial Pentium. At times, it was even slower, but when programs started coming out that really used the chip, everyone started to understand, not to mention, when you put the chip in a server enviorment.
--I own an Athlon 1800 that I enjoy a great deal, so I hope you don't think I'm being biased in any way
BRUTE FORCE
EFFICIENCY
We all know the Athlon and P3 are very effecient chips. The P4 is a screaming giant cable of very high speeds. Honestly, it doesn't matter which way you plan to go, as long as the end result is a fast core. No matter how you say it, the P4 is still one hell of a chip. Don't forget that the P4 was also originally matched up with rambus as it's soul mate. The P4 rambus platform can be a monster.
Look at these benchmarks and you will see what I mean. The future is still very bright for the P4 architechture.
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q1/020225/p42666-08.html
Here are 3 Finally thoughts.
--Pentium4 on 533Mhz bus with Dual Channel Ram ROCKS
--I'm not a Intel lover, I just like looking at the good and bad in a product, not just the bad. Everyone knows that when the original P4 at 1.3, 1.4 and 1.5GHz came out, it wasn't very fast, but this is the case with most chip launches. When the Pentium Pro arrived on the scene, everyone said it wasn't that much faster then the orignial Pentium. At times, it was even slower, but when programs started coming out that really used the chip, everyone started to understand, not to mention, when you put the chip in a server enviorment.
--I own an Athlon 1800 that I enjoy a great deal, so I hope you don't think I'm being biased in any way
kazuza
05-05-2002, 12:12 AM
Get serious!
AMD's XP will beat P4 cool
Test:
2 Identical boards (sockets diferent, possibly same chipset)
P4 uses DIMMS 800MHz
XP usesDDRs 266MHz
Same graphics board (GF3 Ti 200)
Same amount of memory
3D Mark 2001 PRO results?
XP 4x faster
P4 beats XP only in flutuation test
P4 2GHz
XP 1800+
What do you say now?
I would say:
Hastalavista P4! :D
AMD's XP will beat P4 cool
Test:
2 Identical boards (sockets diferent, possibly same chipset)
P4 uses DIMMS 800MHz
XP usesDDRs 266MHz
Same graphics board (GF3 Ti 200)
Same amount of memory
3D Mark 2001 PRO results?
XP 4x faster
P4 beats XP only in flutuation test
P4 2GHz
XP 1800+
What do you say now?
I would say:
Hastalavista P4! :D
suprsheep2
05-05-2002, 01:19 AM
Yeah, the P4 might get better when they up the FSB from 400 to 533. But untill then it sucks. P3 all the way!
Slipknot
05-06-2002, 01:06 AM
I going to say this to both kazuza and suprsheep2 :
The only thing consistent in the computer industry is CHANGE. I understand you guys think the P3 is a great chip, and i'm not arguing that fact, but I'm just saying every technology has to have an ending point. No matter how you cut it, the P3 is nothing more then an EXTREMELY modified Pentium Pro with more logic gates and execution units( MMX, SSE, yada yada yada). It was and still is great technology, but the light is slowly fading. I guess what is bothing me is some of the comparisons being made.
Everyone knows, that the original Athlon and the P3 were pretty close in overall performance, but the Athlon had the stronger FPU. When you compare an Athlon to a P4, you are getting alot more performance out of the Athlon per clock then the P4, but the P4 can scale WAY HIGHER. THAT IS HOW INTEL DESIGNED THE CHIP TO GET MORE PERFORMANCE. This is not a bad thing. Intel just decided to use BRUTE FORCE (higher MHz) to raise the chip performance instead of a more effecient pipeline. Honestly it doesn't mater which method they use, as long as the chip performance continues to increase. I know I personally don't care, I just want maximum performance.
The only thing you guys keep pointing out is the overlaping performance of the orignal P4s and the newer P3s. This DOESN'T matter. Every new chip generation overlaps in performance with the previous generation some. This happens all the time and it will probably continye to happen in new generations of chips. However, the Newer generation of chips always trounce the older chips as times moves on.
Now to tackle kazuza's little comparison. First off, everyone knows that measuring performance by MHz is useless, so lets throw that out the door. Secondly, there is and will not be a chipset that supports both Athlons and P4s. Thirdly, 800 "dimms" don't exsist. 800MHz Rimms do however. And lastly, If you really want to do a comparison of the top of the line CPUs, then you should put each chip on the platform it performs best in. No matter how you cut it, the P4 is better with Rambus and will continue to be for at least the remainder of the year. I know you guys don't want to hear it, but the P3 is old news and it isn't going to change. Get over it. The P4 is maturing into the paltform intel designed it to be, and the P3 at 1.3Ghz on its current chipset platforms can't hold a candle to it. I will also say this once again, I'm not a fan of the P4, I perfer my Athlon XP 1800, but I do think realisticly about products, and don't fudge numbers to make them what I want them to be. Have a nice day :)
The only thing consistent in the computer industry is CHANGE. I understand you guys think the P3 is a great chip, and i'm not arguing that fact, but I'm just saying every technology has to have an ending point. No matter how you cut it, the P3 is nothing more then an EXTREMELY modified Pentium Pro with more logic gates and execution units( MMX, SSE, yada yada yada). It was and still is great technology, but the light is slowly fading. I guess what is bothing me is some of the comparisons being made.
Everyone knows, that the original Athlon and the P3 were pretty close in overall performance, but the Athlon had the stronger FPU. When you compare an Athlon to a P4, you are getting alot more performance out of the Athlon per clock then the P4, but the P4 can scale WAY HIGHER. THAT IS HOW INTEL DESIGNED THE CHIP TO GET MORE PERFORMANCE. This is not a bad thing. Intel just decided to use BRUTE FORCE (higher MHz) to raise the chip performance instead of a more effecient pipeline. Honestly it doesn't mater which method they use, as long as the chip performance continues to increase. I know I personally don't care, I just want maximum performance.
The only thing you guys keep pointing out is the overlaping performance of the orignal P4s and the newer P3s. This DOESN'T matter. Every new chip generation overlaps in performance with the previous generation some. This happens all the time and it will probably continye to happen in new generations of chips. However, the Newer generation of chips always trounce the older chips as times moves on.
Now to tackle kazuza's little comparison. First off, everyone knows that measuring performance by MHz is useless, so lets throw that out the door. Secondly, there is and will not be a chipset that supports both Athlons and P4s. Thirdly, 800 "dimms" don't exsist. 800MHz Rimms do however. And lastly, If you really want to do a comparison of the top of the line CPUs, then you should put each chip on the platform it performs best in. No matter how you cut it, the P4 is better with Rambus and will continue to be for at least the remainder of the year. I know you guys don't want to hear it, but the P3 is old news and it isn't going to change. Get over it. The P4 is maturing into the paltform intel designed it to be, and the P3 at 1.3Ghz on its current chipset platforms can't hold a candle to it. I will also say this once again, I'm not a fan of the P4, I perfer my Athlon XP 1800, but I do think realisticly about products, and don't fudge numbers to make them what I want them to be. Have a nice day :)
kazuza
05-06-2002, 04:24 AM
My mistake. P4 was ridding in RIMMS.
Thanks for the correction.
But the benchmark was not mesured in CPU MHz count.
It was mesured in overall performance for graphics calculations output (3D Mark 2001 PRO)
Thanks for the correction.
But the benchmark was not mesured in CPU MHz count.
It was mesured in overall performance for graphics calculations output (3D Mark 2001 PRO)
Slipknot
05-06-2002, 12:03 PM
Hum, that is interesting. I just did a search on MadOnion.
--The highest P3 score with any video card is 9398. The P3 that achieved that score was clocked at 1440Mhz. The video card used is a TI4600
-The are two P3s a couple places down running at 1617Mhz and 1607Mhz that score 9287 and 9265. One is using a TI4600 the other a Radeon 8500
After this, I did a search for the Highest P4s running between 1800Mhz and 2100Mhz. I already know P4s running at high speeds will destroy the P3 in this benchmark, so i'm trying to give the P3 a chance.
-The highest performing P4 under 2100Mhz is cpietras@srnet.com's machine. It runs at 2080Mhz and uses a TI4600 and scores 11341.
-The first 5 pages of the search all show over a 10319 3Dmark score.
-Well, I'm geting board of pressing the next button on the search results. I'm currently on page 35 and the lowest P4 on that page shows a score of 9417. STILL HIGHER THEN YOUR BELOVED P3
-Each of the pages had 20 systems on it and I looked at 35 pages of results. So that means I looked at 700 Runs of the benchmark compared to your P3. Don't forget you said that the P3 is higher in this benchmark.
I could have kept pressing the next button, but my point is made. You are either fudging your results or just pulling random numbers out the air to make your points.
Maybe you'll be honest with yoru statments now. 700 runs of the benchmark don't lie.
--The highest P3 score with any video card is 9398. The P3 that achieved that score was clocked at 1440Mhz. The video card used is a TI4600
-The are two P3s a couple places down running at 1617Mhz and 1607Mhz that score 9287 and 9265. One is using a TI4600 the other a Radeon 8500
After this, I did a search for the Highest P4s running between 1800Mhz and 2100Mhz. I already know P4s running at high speeds will destroy the P3 in this benchmark, so i'm trying to give the P3 a chance.
-The highest performing P4 under 2100Mhz is cpietras@srnet.com's machine. It runs at 2080Mhz and uses a TI4600 and scores 11341.
-The first 5 pages of the search all show over a 10319 3Dmark score.
-Well, I'm geting board of pressing the next button on the search results. I'm currently on page 35 and the lowest P4 on that page shows a score of 9417. STILL HIGHER THEN YOUR BELOVED P3
-Each of the pages had 20 systems on it and I looked at 35 pages of results. So that means I looked at 700 Runs of the benchmark compared to your P3. Don't forget you said that the P3 is higher in this benchmark.
I could have kept pressing the next button, but my point is made. You are either fudging your results or just pulling random numbers out the air to make your points.
Maybe you'll be honest with yoru statments now. 700 runs of the benchmark don't lie.
Slipknot
05-06-2002, 12:06 PM
Here is some more glass for you to chew on. Enjoy, but don't bite down too hard
http://www.anandtech.com/cpu/showdoc.html?i=1615
http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q2/020506/index.html
http://www.anandtech.com/cpu/showdoc.html?i=1615
http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q2/020506/index.html
Bsamuels
05-06-2002, 01:22 PM
moo
kazuza
05-06-2002, 06:47 PM
I was comparing P4 to AMD's XP!!! :eek:
NDD
05-07-2002, 09:56 PM
moo
Is everything OK, Bsamuels :confused:
Is everything OK, Bsamuels :confused:
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